MSU Hoops

BelgradeBobcat · Post by **BelgradeBobcat** » Fri Dec 31, 2004 2:21 pm

If our track record in retaining high school players was better I would say go that route-but it hasn't been very good-so Durham did the right thing in going after JC's.

The list of high school players that we've lost for one reason or another is extremely long in the last 10 or so years.

MSU88 · Post by **MSU88** » Fri Dec 31, 2004 2:34 pm

I have been a life long supporter of Coach Durham. I do not agree with the JC route............I understand it tho. If we were 10-2 or 9-3 bringing in JC players things would be more acceptable. I do not think most of the JC transfers know anything about "team" basketball. Without a "team" philosophy you will not win in the Big Sky Conference. I believe I would rather take some lumps early with Montana kids that are loyal to the program that will be around 4 years and lose a few than be 5-7 and only up 26-24 late in the first half against Montana Tech with these JC transfers. I would rather give Mick a 4 year contract (which you cannot do in Montana) and tell him to build back to respectabilty. What we have done is put so much pressure to win on him that he has decided on a "quick fix" that is not fixing anthing. I will reserve any further judgement until we get back from the first week of Big Sky play at Weber St./ISU. With victories there, the JC route may survive. With losses there we have done nothing except alienate our 4-year players and Montana fans.

MSU88 · Post by **MSU88** » Sat Jan 01, 2005 12:15 am

I shouldn't say "have been." I still very much am a supporter of Mick.

BobCatFan · Post by **BobCatFan** » Sat Jan 01, 2005 12:50 pm

The last good high school recruit that Mick has been able to land was Erickson. The last power forward with any low post skills was? (Can think of his name but he was from Minnesota).

Mick is a poor recruiter of new high schools kids, and maybe it is hard to find kids with excellent skills, good academics, and good character. For the most part, Mick has gotten kids with good character and is probable why Mick has lasted so long, but men’s college basketball is one of the sports that a college athletic department relies on funding the other programs.

Having a winning program will attract the dollars that MSU needs. Look at what Kramer has done with the football team. We need a Kramer like coach for the men’s basketball team.

I know some of you will disagree with me, but it truly is about the money, and Mick has not been able to bring it in because he cannot build a winning program.

twentythreeOh4 · Post by **twentythreeOh4** » Sat Jan 01, 2005 2:49 pm

BobCatFan wrote:Mick is a poor recruiter of new high schools kids, and maybe it is hard to find kids with excellent skills, good academics, and good character.

Are you kidding? Kids like that are a dime a dozen. It's only MSU that has hard time finding them. Every other D-I coach has those types of kids coming out their ears.

CATTRACKER · Post by **CATTRACKER** » Sat Jan 01, 2005 4:24 pm

HOW CAN YOU SAY THAT Jason Erickson was Mick's "last quality recruit?!!!" I believe the problem is more that the coaching staff has not developed a lot of good athletes to the next level. Jason Erickson was a decent ballplayer, but last year he was a one-man show. The last time I checked BB was a team sport. . . and I believe if you check the stats more games were won when 3 or 4 players scored in double digits than when Jason scored 20+ points. There is a fine line between being the go-to guy and being a run-and-gunner, and the line is drawn over whether the ball goes through the hoop or not. On a hot night a hero, on a cold night a bum. Don't forget the other aspects of the game; free throws, defense, rebounds, steals, assists, FREE THROWS. I feel that basic fundamentals are weak, like shooting the ball from 25 feet out with nobody in rebounding position, crashing the boards, boxing out, grabbing the ball with both hands on rebounds. That is a COACHING issue. They need to be reminded on every time out to do those things. It should be automatic, like buckling your seat belt, but it is always a good idea to remind everybody to do it. I am sure that team building could be done better, and that is a weakness inherent with being heavy on JC recruits.

CARDIAC_CATS · Post by **CARDIAC_CATS** » Sat Jan 01, 2005 4:51 pm

CATTRACKER wrote:HOW CAN YOU SAY THAT Jason Erickson was Mick's "last quality recruit?!!!" I believe the problem is more that the coaching staff has not developed a lot of good athletes to the next level. Jason Erickson was a decent ballplayer, but last year he was a one-man show. The last time I checked BB was a team sport. . . and I believe if you check the stats more games were won when 3 or 4 players scored in double digits than when Jason scored 20+ points. There is a fine line between being the go-to guy and being a run-and-gunner, and the line is drawn over whether the ball goes through the hoop or not. On a hot night a hero, on a cold night a bum. Don't forget the other aspects of the game; free throws, defense, rebounds, steals, assists, FREE THROWS. I feel that basic fundamentals are weak, like shooting the ball from 25 feet out with nobody in rebounding position, crashing the boards, boxing out, grabbing the ball with both hands on rebounds. That is a COACHING issue. They need to be reminded on every time out to do those things. It should be automatic, like buckling your seat belt, but it is always a good idea to remind everybody to do it. I am sure that team building could be done better, and that is a weakness inherent with being heavy on JC recruits.

Excellent post. Totally agree. Baseketball is a total team sport. It is all about doing the little things/team chemistry etc. You can take a team over 'average' players and beat stronger teams by doing the 'little' things and passing the ball. The 'good' team style teams can get good open looks to the basket (bunnies) by passing/screening/working hard. If you can do that and have players that can knock down the wide open shot you don't need as many guys that can create stuff. Princeton offense is a major example of this. Like it was said above, free throws/rebounding/screening/calling screens and switching/boxing out/getting good passing angles when passing it into the post etc. etc. etc. This should ALL be stressed to the players non-stop as the teams that can do the little things are the ones that will progress/succeed later in the year.

I have said before though that I am not a big supporter of the run/gun launch 3 offense we've seen for the Cats these past few years though. You cannot stay consitent with that type of scheme and you may win some big game against some good teams, but your also going to lose a lot of games when your cold etc. That pretty much spells out another middle of the road team again in my book ..... we'll see how it shakes out. Durhams good teams were 'balanced' both inside and outside and I just have not seen that lately. Our offense is totally permiter based with our players have no conscience on blasting up a 30 foot 3 with a guy in their face. I see no reaction from Durham when he sees our guys missing these and forcing shots. I also see too many players standing out past the 3 point line watching the shot go up and then backing down the court? So that pretty much gives us 2 rebounders max. We'll see I guess now that Beye is back. This team needs to be more balanced though to have any success late in the Big Sky Conference season/tournament.

Helcat72 · Post by **Helcat72** » Sat Jan 01, 2005 6:00 pm

Mick seemingly coaches every team just like he has a ton of talent. It worked with Quadre and Nico, and with Danny and Nate...but when you don't have that kind of individual talent maybe you had better coach a team oriented type of game (like Princeton) Maybe you got to change with the talent rather than making the talent fit your coaching style.

Helcat72 · Post by **Helcat72** » Sat Jan 01, 2005 9:45 pm

I'm not sure Mick can recruit good high school talent. Everytime he does they tend to leave rather than endure mediocre seasons for four years. Maybe JC talent, where they are there for two years and then gone, is about all he can get to come to MSU.

When was the last time he successfully recruited more than two or so high school kids in any year?

MSU88 · Post by **MSU88** » Sun Jan 02, 2005 12:29 am

Helcat72:

You are right and wrong. First of all, the Cats do need to play team ball which they are not doing at the present time. You have JC players that are used to being "the man" and they are not sharing the ball, thus the 5-7 record. Secondly, Mick recruited two great high school players in Dissly and Durr. Both MVP's of the state tourney and both lead their teams to perfect records and the state title. Dissly has been given a fair chance to excel, especially as a freshman. I must agree that Durr should have been redshirted, but this year....with all the JC players.....Dissly is having a poor year compared to last year (mainly because he is not getting the ball when open) and Durr has not received even close to a fair opportunity. He is solid, fundamentally sound, smart and a team player. I was told by a friend near high school District 6-C that Durr averaged 22 PPG in four high school years while only averaging 16 shots per game. Look who has been on the floor during crucial times that resulted in wins this year.....Dissly, Durr and Durham. The Wyoming game is the best example of this. I sometimes wonder what the Cats record would be with these three in the lineup along with Marvin Moss, Big Al, and Taylor Pratt. We would be building a team, not looking for a quick fix.

CATTRACKER · Post by **CATTRACKER** » Sun Jan 02, 2005 3:26 pm

MSU 88

You said it so well. Thank you!!!

MSU88 · Post by **MSU88** » Sun Jan 02, 2005 4:20 pm

CATTRACKER wrote:MSU 88

You said it so well. Thank you!!!

Thank you. Even though I grew up in western Montana I have been a life-long Bobcat fan. I just want to see what is best for the program. I am a big fan of Montana players playing at MSU and UM. I like what Criswell is doing at UM and the opportunity he was given. Mick will work things out when the conference schedule starts.......his experimentation is probably over now.

velochat · Post by **velochat** » Mon Jan 03, 2005 8:59 am

The Cats may have the best guards in the conference. The loss of Dissly could be very tough. He did the little things. He didn't score a lot because he's very unselfish. If Dissly comes back soon, the Cats could contend in what appears to be an extremely weak conference. I'm unsure how Durham's doing overall, but I know the 5/8 rule killed MSU more than most schools, due to bad luck, health wise. The talent looks much better now, but injuries are taking a big toll again.

I like watching this year's team much more than the past few years. This team is very speedy and there are a lot of offensive skills. Size is the big weakness. The other question is can they play on the road? By the time either Cat team plays in Bozeman again, there will be some trends developing in the conference.

MSU01 · Post by **MSU01** » Mon Jan 03, 2005 3:48 pm

Has anyone heard any new info about Dissly's injury?

loyalbballfan · Post by **loyalbballfan** » Thu Jan 06, 2005 10:05 am

Good job LAZO land (this is the term you gave yourself right) way to be loyal to the guy who paid for your education. Where are you coaching? sounds like you have all of the answers.

CATTRACKER · Post by **CATTRACKER** » Thu Jan 06, 2005 11:42 am

loyalbballfan wrote:Good job LAZO land (this is the term you gave yourself right) way to be loyal to the guy who paid for your education. Where are you coaching? sounds like you have all of the answers.

YO-YO. This posters comments should be "taken with a grain of salt."

CARDIAC_CATS · Post by **CARDIAC_CATS** » Thu Jan 06, 2005 11:56 am

MSU01 wrote:Has anyone heard any new info about Dissly's injury?

From what I have read, it healed really fast and he will be playing (even starting) tonight. Good news.