Binford

[Helcat72]

But even Dan Hawkins couldn't do anything for the Colorado program as it was. So was it his fault or was it just that Colorado couldn't bring in the talent needed? Has Colorado produced any Champions lately?

[John K]

But even Dan Hawkins couldn't do anything for the Colorado program as it was. So was it his fault or was it just that Colorado couldn't bring in the talent needed? Has Colorado produced any Champions lately?

That's completely irrelevant to the point that you raised in your previous post, and which I attempted to refute. Just because he wasn't successful at Colorado, that doesn't negate what he accomplished at BSU. They continued to be successful (even more so) after Hawkins left. Another example would be Gonzaga. Monson is the guy who actually built their program, and after they'd had several great seasons under him, it was much easier for them to get another quality coach in Few, when Monson left. It's a defeatist attitude to say that we don't pay enough to get a decent coach, and/or to say that we shouldn't even try to get a better coach, because he'd probably leave after a few years anyway.

[John K]

Title nine makes them have the scholarships. The alumni pick up the difference in contracts, at least that is my understanding of the way it works. I am sure the women's coach at U Conn makes a lot more than the coach at Northwestern. That is because he brings in the revenue. I live in Utah and our cost of living is only slightly higher than that in Montana. Wages are also slightly higher. The men's coaches make much more than the MSU coaches. Granted the football team plays in a higher division. I just don't see MSU drawing the kind of coach that can turn around the program and I am fairly certain that if they did the coach wouldn't stay long due to better offers elsewhere.

I agree. We won't know what we have until we lose it.with what we can pay, we probably have the best coaches money can buy!

So I guess your solution would consist of accepting continued mediocrity on the floor, and declining attendance in the stands, pretty much forever? That we should just resign ourselves to being on the periphery of the BSC tourney every season, some years sneaking in as the 6 or 7 seed and getting blasted in the 1st round, and some years (like this one probably) not even getting into the tourney? Next year, we're likely to fall below 2,000 in average attendance, but I guess that's not too bad for poor old MSU. We can't really expect to do better than that...right? That's what some people thought about the football program in the late 90"s...that after 15 years of mediocrity, we couldn't ever expect to become a power in the BSC again. It turns out that wasn't really accurate, was it?

[Colter_Nuanez]

Brad Huse is one of the 10 lowest paid coaches in Division I college basketball. I can't imagine there's very many head Division I men's coaches who are lower paid than their woman counterpart. While Binford makes more than Tinkle in base salary, Tinkle's contracts are incentive laden. His base salary is $135,000, but he can make as $146,000 MORE on top of that. Last year when the Griz won the Big Sky and went to the tournament, he made $44,000 in bonuses.

Brian Jones of North Dakota is the only Division I men's coach who makes under 100K. He was making $86,000, lowest in the league when UND joined the Big Sky, but is up to six figures as of last year. He's still last in the league. Randy Rahe at Weber makes $175,000 in base and received an additional $75,000 every July 1 if he's still the coach of the team. That's not to mention his incentives. He makes more than twice what Huse makes without even winning a game. He gets paid $60,000 more than Weber's president!

Jack Murphy at NAU has a base salary of $180,000. Ty Gerving at Portland State has a base salary of $120,000. Brian Katz at Sac State has a base salary of $135,000. Only Jones and Nick Robinson of Southern Utah have lower base salaries than Huse in the Big Sky.

[grizzh8r]

Brad Huse is one of the 10 lowest paid coaches in Division I college basketball. I can't imagine there's very many head Division I men's coaches who are lower paid than their woman counterpart. While Binford makes more than Tinkle in base salary, Tinkle's contracts are incentive laden. His base salary is $135,000, but he can make as $146,000 MORE on top of that. Last year when the Griz won the Big Sky and went to the tournament, he made $44,000 in bonuses.

Brian Jones of North Dakota is the only Division I men's coach who makes under 100K. He was making $86,000, lowest in the league when UND joined the Big Sky, but is up to six figures as of last year. He's still last in the league. Randy Rahe at Weber makes $175,000 in base and received an additional $75,000 every July 1 if he's still the coach of the team. That's not to mention his incentives. He makes more than twice what Huse makes without even winning a game. He gets paid $60,000 more than Weber's president!

Jack Murphy at NAU has a base salary of $180,000. Ty Gerving at Portland State has a base salary of $120,000. Brian Katz at Sac State has a base salary of $135,000. Only Jones and Nick Robinson of Southern Utah have lower base salaries than Huse in the Big Sky.

Wow. I had no idea, that's great stuff Colter.

So in other words, the age old adage of "you get what you pay for" is very apropos to MSU's MBB head coach situation?

Another way to look at it is our beancounter of an AD know's he's got a cheap date and is milking her for all she's worth, for as long as he can. No wonder he offered him a 2 year contract - what a miser!

One could even say MSU BB has overachieved for a while with the piss-poor coach we have.

[John K]

Brad Huse is one of the 10 lowest paid coaches in Division I college basketball. I can't imagine there's very many head Division I men's coaches who are lower paid than their woman counterpart. While Binford makes more than Tinkle in base salary, Tinkle's contracts are incentive laden. His base salary is $135,000, but he can make as $146,000 MORE on top of that. Last year when the Griz won the Big Sky and went to the tournament, he made $44,000 in bonuses.

Brian Jones of North Dakota is the only Division I men's coach who makes under 100K. He was making $86,000, lowest in the league when UND joined the Big Sky, but is up to six figures as of last year. He's still last in the league. Randy Rahe at Weber makes $175,000 in base and received an additional $75,000 every July 1 if he's still the coach of the team. That's not to mention his incentives. He makes more than twice what Huse makes without even winning a game. He gets paid $60,000 more than Weber's president!

Jack Murphy at NAU has a base salary of $180,000. Ty Gerving at Portland State has a base salary of $120,000. Brian Katz at Sac State has a base salary of $135,000. Only Jones and Nick Robinson of Southern Utah have lower base salaries than Huse in the Big Sky.

I had no idea either, so thank you for setting the record straight. Although I still disagree with Helcat72's stance that we can't expect to get a better coach, and therefore shouldn't even try. I don't believe we have much to lose. Fan interest and attendance can't get much lover than it is currently. If we're not going to even try to improve the program, then what's the point?

[SonomaCat]

It gets to a point where, from a business perspective, you have to start asking yourself, "If we paid twice as much for the head coaching salary, would the expected increase in attendance and other revenues more than make up for that?"

I'd have to think it would. I know paying coaches more money often isn't very popular politically, but especially in college basketball (where the overhead of the sport is relatively low) it seems like investing more in a successful basketball coach is generally a really good business decision.

I've often wondered how MSU could do if they did just go out and hire a $500K (or even a $1M) basketball coach. Does a coach (especially a big name one) have as much of an impact on the trajectory of a program as they appear to have? Could doing something like that net better schedules and better recruits and massively higher attendance and more advertisers and tournament wins and lucrative home and home arrangements or paid games, so much so that the program ends up coming out ahead, and able to upgrade facilities, which breeds more success?

I know it's a risk anytime any coach is hired, but I've often daydreamed about how cool it would be for MSU to try that approach -- we would probably need a Bobcat fan with lots of spare cash to make that happen, though.

[Colter_Nuanez]

Brad Huse is one of the 10 lowest paid coaches in Division I college basketball. I can't imagine there's very many head Division I men's coaches who are lower paid than their woman counterpart. While Binford makes more than Tinkle in base salary, Tinkle's contracts are incentive laden. His base salary is $135,000, but he can make as $146,000 MORE on top of that. Last year when the Griz won the Big Sky and went to the tournament, he made $44,000 in bonuses.

Brian Jones of North Dakota is the only Division I men's coach who makes under 100K. He was making $86,000, lowest in the league when UND joined the Big Sky, but is up to six figures as of last year. He's still last in the league. Randy Rahe at Weber makes $175,000 in base and received an additional $75,000 every July 1 if he's still the coach of the team. That's not to mention his incentives. He makes more than twice what Huse makes without even winning a game. He gets paid $60,000 more than Weber's president!

Jack Murphy at NAU has a base salary of $180,000. Ty Gerving at Portland State has a base salary of $120,000. Brian Katz at Sac State has a base salary of $135,000. Only Jones and Nick Robinson of Southern Utah have lower base salaries than Huse in the Big Sky.

I had no idea either, so thank you for setting the record straight. Although I still disagree with Helcat72's stance that we can't expect to get a better coach, and therefore shouldn't even try. I don't believe we have much to lose. Fan interest and attendance can't get much lover than it is currently. If we're not going to even try to improve the program, then what's the point?

In researching the above date, I also came upon attendance stats The year before Huse was hired, MSU averaged 3,506 fans. In his first season, 3,024. Cats finished fifth in a league of nine.

2007-2008: 4,768; 6th place.
2008-2009: 3,387; 6th place
2009-2010: 3,389; tie for 3rd
2010-2011: 3,228; tie for 5th
2011-2012: 2,922; tie for 5th
2012-2013: 2,523; tie for 4th in league of 11.
2013-2014: 2,259; currently in a tie for 8th.

[DicTater]

I don't even know what the booster organization for basketball is called, but it must be tough to get anyone to join or stay active. While the Quarterbacks Club has doubled in size, I would guess the basketball counterpart is about dead.

I realize Huse isn't paid much compared to his counterparts, but if he won as much as Randy Rahe or Tinkle, I imagine he might make more. The problem is, the Cats are in no position to bring in anyone with a name. They are going to have to be looking outside the box and hire a young guy who is looking for a head job, and hope to end up with someone like Shaka Smart at VCU or Brad Stevens at Butler. There are a lot of guys looking for a head coaching job, and there just aren't that many of those around.

Only 3 things in this world are certain: death, taxes, and Huse never being successful.

[John K]

Brad Huse is one of the 10 lowest paid coaches in Division I college basketball. I can't imagine there's very many head Division I men's coaches who are lower paid than their woman counterpart. While Binford makes more than Tinkle in base salary, Tinkle's contracts are incentive laden. His base salary is $135,000, but he can make as $146,000 MORE on top of that. Last year when the Griz won the Big Sky and went to the tournament, he made $44,000 in bonuses.

Brian Jones of North Dakota is the only Division I men's coach who makes under 100K. He was making $86,000, lowest in the league when UND joined the Big Sky, but is up to six figures as of last year. He's still last in the league. Randy Rahe at Weber makes $175,000 in base and received an additional $75,000 every July 1 if he's still the coach of the team. That's not to mention his incentives. He makes more than twice what Huse makes without even winning a game. He gets paid $60,000 more than Weber's president!

Jack Murphy at NAU has a base salary of $180,000. Ty Gerving at Portland State has a base salary of $120,000. Brian Katz at Sac State has a base salary of $135,000. Only Jones and Nick Robinson of Southern Utah have lower base salaries than Huse in the Big Sky.

I had no idea either, so thank you for setting the record straight. Although I still disagree with Helcat72's stance that we can't expect to get a better coach, and therefore shouldn't even try. I don't believe we have much to lose. Fan interest and attendance can't get much lover than it is currently. If we're not going to even try to improve the program, then what's the point?

In researching the above date, I also came upon attendance stats The year before Huse was hired, MSU averaged 3,506 fans. In his first season, 3,024. Cats finished fifth in a league of nine.

2007-2008: 4,768; 6th place.
2008-2009: 3,387; 6th place
2009-2010: 3,389; tie for 3rd
2010-2011: 3,228; tie for 5th
2011-2012: 2,922; tie for 5th
2012-2013: 2,523; tie for 4th in league of 11.
2013-2014: 2,259; currently in a tie for 8th.

Did we really average 4,768 in 2007-08, or is that a typo? Even just comparing 2008-09 to the current season, attendance has plummeted by approximately 33% over the past five years. Last season was the lowest in 35 years, since 1977-78, and it's down another 10% this year.

[rtb]

Brad Huse is one of the 10 lowest paid coaches in Division I college basketball. I can't imagine there's very many head Division I men's coaches who are lower paid than their woman counterpart. While Binford makes more than Tinkle in base salary, Tinkle's contracts are incentive laden. His base salary is $135,000, but he can make as $146,000 MORE on top of that. Last year when the Griz won the Big Sky and went to the tournament, he made $44,000 in bonuses.

Brian Jones of North Dakota is the only Division I men's coach who makes under 100K. He was making $86,000, lowest in the league when UND joined the Big Sky, but is up to six figures as of last year. He's still last in the league. Randy Rahe at Weber makes $175,000 in base and received an additional $75,000 every July 1 if he's still the coach of the team. That's not to mention his incentives. He makes more than twice what Huse makes without even winning a game. He gets paid $60,000 more than Weber's president!

Jack Murphy at NAU has a base salary of $180,000. Ty Gerving at Portland State has a base salary of $120,000. Brian Katz at Sac State has a base salary of $135,000. Only Jones and Nick Robinson of Southern Utah have lower base salaries than Huse in the Big Sky.

So if I read this right you are saying.....Huse is grossly overpaid? Good, that's what I thought I read. Pretty sure we could be Lebron and Durant on this team and Huse would find a way to slow them down and manage the point total to somewhere just south 50 points. Montana State Basketball has become a complete joke. If they are playing on the street in front of my house, I'd have a hard time turning my head to watch us get beat like a rented mule. I wonder what the number of fans between the ages of 25 and 50 are that still attend games in Bozeman. My guess is it is somewhere between 7 and 18.

[Potomac Griz]

Did we really average 4,768 in 2007-08, or is that a typo? Even just comparing 2008-09 to the current season, attendance has plummeted by approximately 33% over the past five years. Last season was the lowest in 35 years, since 1977-78, and it's down another 10% this year.

You guys drew very well that year. I'm guessing Carlos Taylor had something to do with that though. Even the "slow down ya god damned whippersnappers" offense couldn't stop Taylor from putting up 20 points a game in conference that year.

Early on in the season the Cats looked damn good too and had a very challenging non conference schedule.

That team beat Boise State earlier in the year (who ended up in the NCAA tournament with a 25-8 record), gave UNLV a pretty good game (they were an 8 seed in the tournament), gave Nevada a good game (who ended up 21-11), beat Wyoming @Wyoming, only lost by 4 to Arizona State in Arizona (21-13 went to the quarterfinals in the NIT), beat Pepperdine, and looked pretty damn good over all in non conference. Going into conference the Cats had a very respectable 8-5 record and played a very challenging non-conf schedule. They started conference by blowing out the Griz by 16 (Taylor had 34 points). Fast forward a bit and the Cats were 13-8 and 5-3 in conference looking pretty good still.

Then February arrived and the Cats lost 7 of their last 9 (including the last 5 in a row) to finish the season 15-15 and 7-9 in conference losing to Weber in the first round of the Big Sky tournament.

Even during the swoon though you guys were drawing very well. The debacle 96-68 late February loss at home against PSU had 5,100 people there.

[seacat85]

I may be remembering wrong but in a preseason review didn't someone mention that this would be a tough year for Binford (Colter? Gidal?)? Or was that last year? The reasoning was that there was a lack of scholly players on the team because of late departures for various reasons. I want to say that there were several on the team that were last minute walkons. Does that give Binford a flyer on this season and maybe next season if the incoming freshman have to be counted on to play right away?

[kcatz]

This team began the season with only 2 seniors. Right after the semester started Emily Allen left the team and returned unexpectedly to Australia. Two players were red shirted because of injuries and most of season was played with a bench of 9.

One senior (Brumwell), 4 juniors and the rest Soph or red short Freshmen.

[LTown Cat]

This team began the season with only 2 seniors. Right after the semester started Emily Allen left the team and returned unexpectedly to Australia. Two players were red shirted because of injuries and most of season was played with a bench of 9.

One senior (Brumwell), 4 juniors and the rest Soph or red short Freshmen.

Is it possible that this thread was started by Emily or a relative of hers. If so...weak! If not...carry on.

[TomCat88]

The ladies won decidedly again today. Scoring a lot of points of late.

[kcatz]

kcatz wrote:This team began the season with only 2 seniors. Right after the semester started Emily Allen left the team and returned unexpectedly to Australia. Two players were red shirted because of injuries and most of season was played with a bench of 9.

One senior (Brumwell), 4 juniors and the rest Soph or red short Freshmen.

Is it possible that this thread was started by Emily or a relative of hers. If so...weak! If not...carry on.

No I was responding to Seacat85's question regarding injuries, etc. I am not sure what in my post was defending Emily, I posted what the official word was from MSU on her leaving the team.

[LTown Cat]

kcatz wrote:This team began the season with only 2 seniors. Right after the semester started Emily Allen left the team and returned unexpectedly to Australia. Two players were red shirted because of injuries and most of season was played with a bench of 9.

One senior (Brumwell), 4 juniors and the rest Soph or red short Freshmen.

Is it possible that this thread was started by Emily or a relative of hers. If so...weak! If not...carry on.

No I was responding to Seacat85's question regarding injuries, etc. I am not sure what in my post was defending Emily, I posted what the official word was from MSU on her leaving the team.

I was just raising the question based off the screen name and apparent bitterness of the original post.

[seacat85]

kcatz wrote:This team began the season with only 2 seniors. Right after the semester started Emily Allen left the team and returned unexpectedly to Australia. Two players were red shirted because of injuries and most of season was played with a bench of 9.

One senior (Brumwell), 4 juniors and the rest Soph or red short Freshmen.

Is it possible that this thread was started by Emily or a relative of hers. If so...weak! If not...carry on.

No I was responding to Seacat85's question regarding injuries, etc. I am not sure what in my post was defending Emily, I posted what the official word was from MSU on her leaving the team.

I was just raising the question based off the screen name and apparent bitterness of the original post.

Not sure if I need to defend myself here or not but I will and ask forgiveness later. If LTCat is referring to my screen name, sea because I now reside in the Seattle area, cat guess that's obvious, and 85 the year I graduated. Born and raised in Montana and have no relatives in Australia. Don't get the bitterness thing in fact I was wondering if people are being too hard on Binford. And no I'm not related to her either.

[LTown Cat]

kcatz wrote:This team began the season with only 2 seniors. Right after the semester started Emily Allen left the team and returned unexpectedly to Australia. Two players were red shirted because of injuries and most of season was played with a bench of 9.

One senior (Brumwell), 4 juniors and the rest Soph or red short Freshmen.

Is it possible that this thread was started by Emily or a relative of hers. If so...weak! If not...carry on.

No I was responding to Seacat85's question regarding injuries, etc. I am not sure what in my post was defending Emily, I posted what the official word was from MSU on her leaving the team.

I was just raising the question based off the screen name and apparent bitterness of the original post.

Not sure if I need to defend myself here or not but I will and ask forgiveness later. If LTCat is referring to my screen name, sea because I now reside in the Seattle area, cat guess that's obvious, and 85 the year I graduated. Born and raised in Montana and have no relatives in Australia. Don't get the bitterness thing in fact I was wondering if people are being too hard on Binford. And no I'm not related to her either.

I was referring to the original post that started the thread by someone called Downunder.