Why can't the Cats finish a season?

Old Skool Cat · Post by **Old Skool Cat** » Mon Feb 14, 2011 1:05 pm

Looking back at the teams under Coach Huse, a very scary trend stands out -- the Cats have really faltered near the end of the season. In Huse's first season, the cats lost 5 of their last 6, losing the last three of the season; did not make the BSC tourney. In his second season, the Cats lost 7 of the last 9, losing the last 5 of the season; first round loss to Weber in the tourney. In his third season, the Cats lost 7 of their last 8, losing the last five games and backing into the tourney; somehow they pulled it together and made it to the tourney title game losing to PSU. Last season, the Cats lost 5 of their last nine, with a first round tourney loss to PSU. This year, we have already lost seven in a row, with no end in sight. It seems like we really start out well, but just can't finish what we start.

So -- why can't the Cats play well in the second of the season? What is causing theses last season collapses? Is it the team's training and conditioning? Is it guys quitting on the team/coaches? Are the coaches not making the right second half adjustments? Thoughts?

wbtfg · Post by **wbtfg** » Mon Feb 14, 2011 1:17 pm

Old Skool Cat wrote:Looking back at the teams under Coach Huse, a very scary trend stands out -- the Cats have really faltered near the end of the season. In Huse's first season, the cats lost 5 of their last 6, losing the last three of the season; did not make the BSC tourney. In his second season, the Cats lost 7 of the last 9, losing the last 5 of the season; first round loss to Weber in the tourney. In his third season, the Cats lost 7 of their last 8, losing the last five games and backing into the tourney; somehow they pulled it together and made it to the tourney title game losing to PSU. Last season, the Cats lost 5 of their last nine, with a first round tourney loss to PSU. This year, we have already lost seven in a row, with no end in sight. It seems like we really start out well, but just can't finish what we start.

So -- why can't the Cats play well in the second of the season? What is causing theses last season collapses? Is it the team's training and conditioning? Is it guys quitting on the team/coaches? Are the coaches not making the right second half adjustments? Thoughts?

Ive thought about this and have a theory.

Generally I think weve always been one the least talented teams in the league. I think we win some early conference games due to coaching and schemes, but once teams are able to thoroughly scout us we have to rely more on talent than schemes, thus we usually take a nose dive.

If you remember, durhams teams had a reputation for struggling down the stretch as well.

Old Skool Cat · Post by **Old Skool Cat** » Mon Feb 14, 2011 1:36 pm

wbtfg wrote:
Old Skool Cat wrote:Looking back at the teams under Coach Huse, a very scary trend stands out -- the Cats have really faltered near the end of the season. In Huse's first season, the cats lost 5 of their last 6, losing the last three of the season; did not make the BSC tourney. In his second season, the Cats lost 7 of the last 9, losing the last 5 of the season; first round loss to Weber in the tourney. In his third season, the Cats lost 7 of their last 8, losing the last five games and backing into the tourney; somehow they pulled it together and made it to the tourney title game losing to PSU. Last season, the Cats lost 5 of their last nine, with a first round tourney loss to PSU. This year, we have already lost seven in a row, with no end in sight. It seems like we really start out well, but just can't finish what we start.

So -- why can't the Cats play well in the second of the season? What is causing theses last season collapses? Is it the team's training and conditioning? Is it guys quitting on the team/coaches? Are the coaches not making the right second half adjustments? Thoughts?

Ive thought about this and have a theory.

Generally I think weve always been one the least talented teams in the league. I think we win some early conference games due to coaching and schemes, but once teams are able to thoroughly scout us we have to rely more on talent than schemes, thus we usually take a nose dive.

If you remember, durhams teams had a reputation for struggling down the stretch as well.

True that, but Huse was brought in to end that trend, not enhance it.

TIrwin24 · Post by **TIrwin24** » Mon Feb 14, 2011 3:04 pm

Coaching and the inability for the team to gel into one cohesive unit is the reason that they cannot finish.

CelticCat · Post by **CelticCat** » Mon Feb 14, 2011 3:18 pm

For the months February & March, Huse's Bobcats are

06-07: 4-5
07-08: 2-7
08-09: 4-8
09-10: 4-4
10-11: 0-4

ilovethecats · Post by **ilovethecats** » Mon Feb 14, 2011 8:14 pm

simple really. we don't have a team good enough to win. it's always easier to win games early in the season. but coaches are very good at adjusting so teams we might have sneaked away with a win against in january....are usually ready to run us out of the gym in february and march.

we just don't have guys good enough to win. until that changes it'll always be like that here.

Gallatin Griz · Post by **Gallatin Griz** » Mon Feb 14, 2011 9:45 pm

No Vim left in the tank

, queue the bobcat fight song -

"Without the vim,
it's tough to win,
it's true for dear montana state..........."

On a more serious note, you could use at least an assistant coach who has experienced success as a D1 college post player to help recruit and coach up some quality bigs. Your decent big men (I'm talking true centers) at MSU have been few and far between. Just my thoughts....

Old Skool Cat · Post by **Old Skool Cat** » Tue Feb 15, 2011 9:32 am

ilovethecats wrote:simple really. we don't have a team good enough to win. it's always easier to win games early in the season. but coaches are very good at adjusting so teams we might have sneaked away with a win against in january....are usually ready to run us out of the gym in february and march.

we just don't have guys good enough to win. until that changes it'll always be like that here.

I think you may have hit it spot on, and I think it goes to coaching. You said "coaches are very good at adjusting" and that's very true. But wouldn't that lend itself to our team as well? Our coaches are either not doing a good job of bringing quality kids into the program, or they are not very good at making those second half of the season adjustments, or both. If coaches at programs like N. Colorado and SacState are good enough to game plan for us the second time around, why can't our coaches do the same thing? I'm sorry about sounding like a Debbie Downer, but I don't have much faith in this staff to get things turned around, either this season or the next. Like someone else mentioned, if this were our football program, people would be at Coach Ash's door with pitchforks and torches. So why do we allow such mediocrity with our basketball program?

ilovethecats · Post by **ilovethecats** » Tue Feb 15, 2011 10:29 am

Old Skool Cat wrote:
ilovethecats wrote:simple really. we don't have a team good enough to win. it's always easier to win games early in the season. but coaches are very good at adjusting so teams we might have sneaked away with a win against in january....are usually ready to run us out of the gym in february and march.

we just don't have guys good enough to win. until that changes it'll always be like that here.
I think you may have hit it spot on, and I think it goes to coaching. You said "coaches are very good at adjusting" and that's very true. But wouldn't that lend itself to our team as well? Our coaches are either not doing a good job of bringing quality kids into the program, or they are not very good at making those second half of the season adjustments, or both. If coaches at programs like N. Colorado and SacState are good enough to game plan for us the second time around, why can't our coaches do the same thing? I'm sorry about sounding like a Debbie Downer, but I don't have much faith in this staff to get things turned around, either this season or the next. Like someone else mentioned, if this were our football program, people would be at Coach Ash's door with pitchforks and torches. So why do we allow such mediocrity with our basketball program?

oldskool, unfortunately we're ALL sounding like debbie downers. that is what happens when your favorite team is playing as bad as the cats have been. i was getting blasted pretty hard in the pat month for questioning the players and coaches on this team. in the end, basically what i was saying is that all across the board our talent is poor. so even guys that are OUR best guys....doesn't mean they are great.

in the end, the part of your post i focused on was the part in huge letters above. in the end, in gameday situations....talented players trump everything. a very talented team can make a pretty average coach look good. huse has a couple strikes against him. he is not a good recruiter at all. this was known when he came in. but he made the best move he has made to date by assembling a great staff of assistants that were great recruiters. in the end, we were able to bring in some pretty talented kids, and while we still didn't have a ton of success, we at least at a team with just enough talent to win games.

fast-forward to today. the recruiting is still horrible. huse is a decent gameday coach but as i have said before, with the guys on this team this year right now....i don't care if we had pitino or roy williams coaching....we'd still be bad. look at our roster, try very hard to be objective, and you will see that we likely have the least talent in the conference. and this all comes down to coaching. until huse figures out how to recruit, or can get guys back on his staff able to recruit, seasons like this will be par for the

course....

Billings_Griz · Post by **Billings_Griz** » Tue Feb 15, 2011 11:10 am

CelticCat wrote:For the months February & March, Huse's Bobcats are

06-07: 4-5
07-08: 2-7
08-09: 4-8
09-10: 4-4
10-11: 0-4

Without talking about last year that looks like your football records year in and year out...

sorry.

Post by **kmax** » Tue Feb 15, 2011 11:19 am

Billings_Griz wrote:
CelticCat wrote:For the months February & March, Huse's Bobcats are

06-07: 4-5
07-08: 2-7
08-09: 4-8
09-10: 4-4
10-11: 0-4

Without talking about last year that looks like your football records year in and year out...

sorry.

You know, usually you are a pretty good poster and even wear the blue and gold well (don't make me pull out the pics

) but that about the weakest attempt at smack I have seen man. Last Bobcat Football season at or below .500 was a decade ago.

bigmacvirginia · Post by **bigmacvirginia** » Thu Feb 17, 2011 3:29 pm

I think we should look at the schedule for the months of Feb and March and see how many home vs road games MSU has the past 5-6 seasons and who are we playing. Are the games vs the better team in the conference or are the road games vs top of conference or bottom. That has alot to do with winning late in the season if you look around the country i would imagine. And didnt HUSe team lose to Portland State in the BSC tourney in the playoff game his 1st year? i could be wrong but i saw a post saying they didnt even make the BSC tourney that year?? As far as talent goes i think they are middle of the pack in BSC. i really like Shawn Reid and tre johnson potential. Seniors need to step up and play like seniors for this team to have any chance of making a late run which i think they will. Its not about coaching adjustments at this time of year. its about players making plays in critical situations. If Bobby wouldnt have shot 8-26 vs Sac State they win that game. if he even shoots 11/26 they probably win by 3-4. Huse and his staff cannot go shoot open shots, they have been getting open quality shots from the games that i have seen in person. So quit blaming the coaches, players need to step up make plays especially the seniors. i will always support the Cats as we all should

Old Skool Cat · Post by **Old Skool Cat** » Thu Feb 17, 2011 3:36 pm

bigmacvirginia wrote:I think we should look at the schedule for the months of Feb and March and see how many home vs road games MSU has the past 5-6 seasons and who are we playing. Are the games vs the better team in the conference or are the road games vs top of conference or bottom. That has alot to do with winning late in the season if you look around the country i would imagine. And didnt HUSe team lose to Portland State in the BSC tourney in the playoff game his 1st year? i could be wrong but i saw a post saying they didnt even make the BSC tourney that year?? As far as talent goes i think they are middle of the pack in BSC. i really like Shawn Reid and tre johnson potential. Seniors need to step up and play like seniors for this team to have any chance of making a late run which i think they will. Its not about coaching adjustments at this time of year. its about players making plays in critical situations. If Bobby wouldnt have shot 8-26 vs Sac State they win that game. if he even shoots 11/26 they probably win by 3-4. Huse and his staff cannot go shoot open shots, they have been getting open quality shots from the games that i have seen in person. So quit blaming the coaches, players need to step up make plays especially the seniors. i will always support the Cats as we all should

So, make up your mind bigmac! In this post, you put the blame on the players for not stepping up and knocking down the shots, but yet in your very first post on another thread you were scolding posters on this board for not getting behind the players. Can't have it both ways my friend! Listen, when you are on this board, you talking with some of the most rabid Bobcat fans in the state, perhaps the nation. No one wants our players or programs to succeed more than we do. We wear our emotions and loyalties on our sleeves. As down as we all might be about our men's b-ball program, I am pretty sure that we are all still behind them 100%. But please try not to be the kettle calling the pot black.

ilovethecats · Post by **ilovethecats** » Thu Feb 17, 2011 4:14 pm

Old Skool Cat wrote: So, make up your mind bigmac! In this post, you put the blame on the players for not stepping up and knocking down the shots, but yet in your very first post on another thread you were scolding posters on this board for not getting behind the players. Can't have it both ways my friend! Listen, when you are on this board, you talking with some of the most rabid Bobcat fans in the state, perhaps the nation. No one wants our players or programs to succeed more than we do. We wear our emotions and loyalties on our sleeves. As down as we all might be about our men's b-ball program, I am pretty sure that we are all still behind them 100%. But please try not to be the kettle calling the pot black.

nice post. i was thinking the same thing. so...on one hand all of our players have improved and are very talented. but on the other hand we play supposed tough teams to end our seasons and that is why we lose. certainly not the coaches. certainly not the players. and definitely not the talent.

it's because we miss open shots and play difficult schedules. (which isn't true either by the way) cats are notorious for finishing horrible no matter who we play. unless the line of thinking is that the cats are a very good team whether they are in last place or not...so every team is tough. personally, finishing with idaho state, portland state, and eastern washington shouldn't be viewed as "hard"....although the outcomes will make it look that way.

to say it is not about coaching adjustments this time of year is laughable. that is EXACTLY what it is this time of year. knowing your opponent, creating mismatches, and taking advantage of weaknesses. of course coaches can't shoot the ball for the players....but they can run plays within a system that feeds off the ability of the players. we don't do that.

and to blame sundays loss to sac on bobbys shooting is also crazy. sure he shot a poor percentage. if you've been watching he usually does. but he played his butt off, was very aggressive, and at times looked like the only guy on our team who wanted it. i have been as hard on bobby as anyone here...but the truth is he's still playing like there is something to play for.

Helcat72 · Post by **Helcat72** » Thu Feb 17, 2011 4:52 pm

I feel that our players are a notch below a lot of the other teams over all talent-wise and in early games, the coaching is good enough to win...but when the other teams find out our weaknesses...they take advantage of them and no amount of coaching in the world is enough to over come those weaknesses in talent!

BelgradeBobcat · Post by **BelgradeBobcat** » Thu Feb 17, 2011 6:34 pm

We lost to Sac State at home. That makes us, by any objective standard, a bad team. And considering how rarely Sac State wins a road game and where the Hornets are in the RPI it might make us the worst team.

When our administration and coaches accept this, they can begin to implement the changes necessary to improve. I am afraid they are in denial, the status quo will prevail, and many more losing season will be the result.

ilovethecats · Post by **ilovethecats** » Fri Feb 18, 2011 10:56 am

Helcat72 wrote:I feel that our players are a notch below a lot of the other teams over all talent-wise and in early games, the coaching is good enough to win...but when the other teams find out our weaknesses...they take advantage of them and no amount of coaching in the world is enough to over come those weaknesses in talent!

THANK YOU!!!!

can't believe how much i was blasted for saying exactly that. it's not being mean. it's not being out to get anyone. it's not being a bad fan. it IS what it IS....

wbtfg · Post by **wbtfg** » Fri Feb 18, 2011 11:02 am

Helcat72 wrote:I feel that our players are a notch below a lot of the other teams over all talent-wise and in early games, the coaching is good enough to win...but when the other teams find out our weaknesses...they take advantage of them and no amount of coaching in the world is enough to over come those weaknesses in talent!

Yes...I attempted to say the same thing earlier in the thread, but you did a much better job of articulating.

wbtfg · Post by **wbtfg** » Fri Feb 18, 2011 11:11 am

It would be interesting to see Will do an extensive sit down interview with coach Huse after the season. Asking him...

-why our teams seem to struggle down the stretch

-why it's been so difficult over the past 15 seasons to have a successful season (since 1996 we've won 1 regular season championship, and 0 tournament championships)

-why is it so difficult to recruit to MSU (specifically a quality big man)

-is this where you thought the program would be after first 5 years (70-77 no conference titles)

-where do you see the program 5 years from now

-what needs to change to get over the hump of being a perennial .500 team

BelgradeBobcat · Post by **BelgradeBobcat** » Fri Feb 18, 2011 1:46 pm

wbtfg wrote:It would be interesting to see Will do an extensive sit down interview with coach Huse after the season. Asking him...

-why our teams seem to struggle down the stretch

-why it's been so difficult over the past 15 seasons to have a successful season (since 1996 we've won 1 regular season championship, and 0 tournament championships)

-why is it so difficult to recruit to MSU (specifically a quality big man)

-is this where you thought the program would be after first 5 years (70-77 no conference titles)

-where do you see the program 5 years from now

-what needs to change to get over the hump of being a perennial .500 team

I would so welcome this. But all we ever seem to get is the same old platitudes.

It would also be interesting to get the perspective of former coaches Mick Durham and maybe even Stu Starner. And how about a perspective about MSU basketball from other Big Sky coaches, current and/or former.

Why can't the Cats finish a season?

Why can't the Cats finish a season?

Re: Re: Why can't the Cats finish a season?

Re: Re: Why can't the Cats finish a season?

Re: Why can't the Cats finish a season?

Re: Why can't the Cats finish a season?

Re: Why can't the Cats finish a season?

Re: Why can't the Cats finish a season?

Re: Why can't the Cats finish a season?

Re: Why can't the Cats finish a season?

Re: Why can't the Cats finish a season?

Re: Why can't the Cats finish a season?

Re: Why can't the Cats finish a season?

Re: Why can't the Cats finish a season?

Re: Why can't the Cats finish a season?

Re: Why can't the Cats finish a season?

Re: Why can't the Cats finish a season?

Re: Why can't the Cats finish a season?

Re: Why can't the Cats finish a season?

Re: Why can't the Cats finish a season?

Re: Why can't the Cats finish a season?