shocking

Post by **SonomaCat** » Thu Jul 21, 2005 4:21 pm

So I guess we can just agree to disagree. I am against negatively judging people based on how they were born.

If you have some free time, do some reading on the history of the KKK. I think you'd be surprised by what you find about the attitudes of our society during that era and what the motivation of the beliefs arose from. My analogy might become more palatable afterwards. It might also begin to dispel your notion of a decline in the moral foundation of our country. If morals have anything at all to do with doing unto others, then we are at an all-time high in morality and getting better.

grizbeer · Post by **grizbeer** » Thu Jul 21, 2005 4:38 pm

Honestly if you can make the jump that the right is responsible for this kids death because of their "homophobic agenda" can't you also make the argument that the left is responsible for the molestation and death of Dylan Groene and others due to their acceptance and pushing the "homosexual agenda"? It would certainly appear the left is responsible from this information:

OLYMPIA – Even while in prison, Joseph Duncan III attracted advocates who lobbied for his early release, paying for lawyers, complaining to state lawmakers and browbeating state correctional officials in letters and in person.

"He is open, honest and eager to move on with his life," one such supporter, named David Woelfert, wrote to parole officials in 1993. "He is no threat to society whatsoever."

Today, Duncan sits in the Kootenai County jail, accused of slaying an Idaho family with a claw hammer in May and kidnapping two children from the home. Authorities in at least two other states are considering additional charges.

But a decade ago, Woelfert was so taken with the young inmate that he loaned him $3,000, paid his initial rent in a halfway house and reportedly became Duncan's lover, even as Duncan dated women and experimented with cross-dressing.

"It is my intention to back him, support him, and help him in any way possible upon his release," Woelfert had written in 1991, shortly after meeting Duncan. "I will 'be there' for him. I believe him. I believe IN him."

and

His mother, Lillian Duncan, said her son had overcome tremendous hurdles, from para-typhoid to bedwetting to being badly spoiled by his father.

"I tried and tried to properly train him up in an authoritarian Christian manner, but his Dad had apparently been raised in a very liberal fashion," she wrote to the state Indeterminate Sentence Review Board (ISRB) in 1988.

Of course both arguments are ridiculous, but it didn't stop 3 pages of debate over a silly accusation.

Post by **SonomaCat** » Thu Jul 21, 2005 4:47 pm

Agreed -- messed up stuff like that isn't the direct result of anything other than messed up people. I think we all disregarded the direct connection between the two for the most part and focused more on the high level issues as opposed to discussing any causal relationship. Homophobia certainly exists in our country and is certainly defended vigorously and even encouraged by many on the right, but the child abuse example was obviously used heavy-handedly in the article to make a point in a way that wasn't particularly logical or compelling.