Hack sticking it it Hartman

mslacat · Post by **mslacat** » Sat Apr 17, 2004 2:02 pm

Hey Moderators I really think that I should have started this thread on the other board. It really has little to nothing to do with the Bobcats if you would not mind I think a switch is in order.

Nick · Post by **Nick** » Sat Apr 17, 2004 6:14 pm

catatac wrote:
kmax wrote:The problem with the argument of making sure Hartman can't go to another BSC school is that he can't play for two years, as others have pointed out. Yeah, but Hauck says he doesn't want him to give away our signals and stuff. BS! If Hartman is that upset at Hauck and that dishonest of a person that he would do that in the first place, there is nothing keeping him from calling up Kramer this summer or sending him an email(heck, maybe he can send it to the press at the same time!) and giving up all the plays and hand signals anyway. Hauck is rubbing Hartman's nose in the mess he created, plain and simple. I would probably be tempted to do the same thing as Hartman's actions were poor and he deserves it, but it is definately not a good PR move on Hauck's part.
Why should Baby change his stripes and make good PR decisions now? Remember the "No fan cameras during practice" rule? Or the complaining about how their schedule is too hard this year, or crying about having to take a bus to Portland? Or belittling Kane Ione during the post Cat\Griz game interview? This is just another example that he has alot to learn about being a leader and a head football coach. No way Hauck can guide that team back to the Nat'l Championship. Not until he matures as a leader anyway...

JW......How did Bobby Hauck belittle Kane Ioane?

I sometimes don't think Cat fans have the right to speak of poor PR by a first year head coach considering Mike Kramer's track record.....By the way, whatever happened to Tyler Thomas? Last time I saw him was 2002 in Missoula along with 4 other MSU players flipping off the east side of Washington-Grizzly Stadium.......

lifeloyalsigmsu · Post by **lifeloyalsigmsu** » Sat Apr 17, 2004 7:41 pm

I sometimes don't think Cat fans have the right to speak of poor PR by a first year head coach considering Mike Kramer's track record.....By the way, whatever happened to Tyler Thomas? Last time I saw him was 2002 in Missoula along with 4 other MSU players flipping off the east side of Washington-Grizzly Stadium.......

Kramer has gone through his times of saying some suspect things but he has never berated other teams nor their coaches. Baby Hoax seems to insert his foot in his mouth EVERY time he speaks. As for Thomas and gang, flipping off the griz fans was totally uncalled for if that was the case. On the other hand, I can only imagine what kind of words and gestures were being returned or perhaps they were started by griz fans themselves. We'll never know so it's really a moot point. Care to bitch about something else Nick? That seems to be the theme with all of your posts.....

Helcat72 · Post by **Helcat72** » Sat Apr 17, 2004 8:19 pm

The flipping thing happens in both stadiums. the last time Joe Glenn's team played in Bozeman a couple of the friz reserves got into a "flipping off and smack talking contest with a few fans. coach glenn came over and grabbed them by the face masks and told them to turn around and behave. I think even the fans might have gottenthe message!

Nick · Post by **Nick** » Sun Apr 18, 2004 1:21 am

lifeloyalsigmsu wrote:
I sometimes don't think Cat fans have the right to speak of poor PR by a first year head coach considering Mike Kramer's track record.....By the way, whatever happened to Tyler Thomas? Last time I saw him was 2002 in Missoula along with 4 other MSU players flipping off the east side of Washington-Grizzly Stadium.......
Kramer has gone through his times of saying some suspect things but he has never berated other teams nor their coaches. Baby Hoax seems to insert his foot in his mouth EVERY time he speaks. As for Thomas and gang, flipping off the griz fans was totally uncalled for if that was the case. On the other hand, I can only imagine what kind of words and gestures were being returned or perhaps they were started by griz fans themselves. We'll never know so it's really a moot point. Care to bitch about something else Nick? That seems to be the theme with all of your posts.....

Alright, so don't answer my questions......

* When has Bobby Hauck belittled a team or player in public...OR their coach?

* Where did Torrey Thomas end up?

* Why didn't you take your Zoloft this morning?

Chill out buddy.......These questions are hardly bitching.

lifeloyalsigmsu · Post by **lifeloyalsigmsu** » Sun Apr 18, 2004 2:28 am

Alright, so don't answer my questions......

* When has Bobby Hauck belittled a team or player in public...OR their coach?

* Where did Torrey Thomas end up?

* Why didn't you take your Zoloft this morning?

Chill out buddy.......These questions are hardly bitching.

First answer, the "state" comment. 'Nuff said there. I watched him for several years while being here at the University of WA. He was an a$$hole while he was here in Seattle.

Torrey Thomas? What does he have to do with this particular question/post?

As for Zoloft, do you have any idea of what that drug is even for? Give it up already......

I'm plenty chilled out; I just can't stand the likes of you jizz fans who think they are the s*it and even worse, the ones who live vicariously through the recent success of the griz. If you want to see bitching, just read your prior posts that you've made on this website.

ecat · Post by **ecat** » Sun Apr 18, 2004 10:04 am

If you griz fans had looked closely during the "flipping off" incident that supposedly occurred, you would have noticed that they were raising their ring fingers.

As in "We get a ring". I have heard the same accusation on many occasions, and thought it was time to set the record straight.

catatac · Post by **catatac** » Sun Apr 18, 2004 10:08 am

Nick wrote:
catatac wrote:
kmax wrote:The problem with the argument of making sure Hartman can't go to another BSC school is that he can't play for two years, as others have pointed out. Yeah, but Hauck says he doesn't want him to give away our signals and stuff. BS! If Hartman is that upset at Hauck and that dishonest of a person that he would do that in the first place, there is nothing keeping him from calling up Kramer this summer or sending him an email(heck, maybe he can send it to the press at the same time!) and giving up all the plays and hand signals anyway. Hauck is rubbing Hartman's nose in the mess he created, plain and simple. I would probably be tempted to do the same thing as Hartman's actions were poor and he deserves it, but it is definately not a good PR move on Hauck's part.
Why should Baby change his stripes and make good PR decisions now? Remember the "No fan cameras during practice" rule? Or the complaining about how their schedule is too hard this year, or crying about having to take a bus to Portland? Or belittling Kane Ione during the post Cat\Griz game interview? This is just another example that he has alot to learn about being a leader and a head football coach. No way Hauck can guide that team back to the Nat'l Championship. Not until he matures as a leader anyway...
JW......How did Bobby Hauck belittle Kane Ioane?

I sometimes don't think Cat fans have the right to speak of poor PR by a first year head coach considering Mike Kramer's track record.....By the way, whatever happened to Tyler Thomas? Last time I saw him was 2002 in Missoula along with 4 other MSU players flipping off the east side of Washington-Grizzly Stadium.......

Kramer has been guilty on numerous occasions, talking too much about certain things, but they're usually based around over-confidence in his team. He has never talked down about another team, players, etc. Baby said in the post-game interview, not exact quote but something along the lines of: "And here in this play, Ochs hands off to Green, Green takes it up the middle, and Kane Ioane tries to bring him down... boy, for as much as they brag this guy up, it looks like he just got his rear-end bowled over by Justin Green." That's just one example.

HelenaCat · Post by **HelenaCat** » Sun Apr 18, 2004 10:24 am

Baby hack also pretty much said the same thing on his weekly TV show the Sunday after the game. He made a comment about how Green put Kane on his rear end all day long. he also made comments belittling Travis Lulay when he was pointing out how Ochs' stats were much better than Lulay's. Never once in the papers or on his show did he say MSU played well, or even that MSU made the big plays and um didn't. All he said was that um gave the game to us and hack's players made mistakes. He also did not blame himself once-just his own players. Even most griz fans that I know noticed a BIG difference with how baby hack acted after this loss and how Kramer has acted in the past when he lost. Even at totally Bobcat functions I have been at, I have never heard Kramer say anything but good things about the griz and their program. Since day one, he has said that the griz have set the bar high and they won't be lowering it. It is up to MSU to climb up to that level.

There is a huge difference in these two coaches. We can all think of times that Kramer has opened his mouth too much, or built up his players and our expectations too much, or even berated his players a bit too much. But baby hack has also berated his players and has rarely, if ever, taken any blame for a loss himself. And he rarely says anything nice about other teams, and has never said anything good about MSU to my knowledge. Kramer does have an ego, but I also sense he does care deeply about his players, especially the ones that are willing to put in the work he demands, and he is bluntly honest. Baby hack reminds me of his mentor New-weasel-enough said.

Bozgriz · Post by **Bozgriz** » Sun Apr 18, 2004 3:00 pm

Wow, this thread has deteriorated into a smack talk, as most cat/Griz conversations end up. I think the bottom line here is that we are talking about a 3rd string, (at best) quitting and making an arse out of himself in public. I'm sure Kramer wouldn't stand for this kind of conduct and understand Bobby making the kid wait it out...

Personally, I don't care where the kid ends up. My conversations with some knowledgeable folks in the profession is that this kid won't end up playing football anywhere in this area. He simply isn't that talented. His open mouth, insert foot actions haven't endeared him to anyone in the college football world. Actually, I would love to go to a cat/Griz game and see Hartman as the starter for the cats...reminds me of Tyler Thomas!

Post by **kmax** » Mon Apr 19, 2004 9:13 am

Agreed mslacat and bozgriz, head on over to the smack forum if you want to continue this one.

catatac · Post by **catatac** » Mon Apr 19, 2004 10:08 am

HelenaCat wrote:Baby hack also pretty much said the same thing on his weekly TV show the Sunday after the game. He made a comment about how Green put Kane on his rear end all day long. he also made comments belittling Travis Lulay when he was pointing out how Ochs' stats were much better than Lulay's. Never once in the papers or on his show did he say MSU played well, or even that MSU made the big plays and um didn't. All he said was that um gave the game to us and hack's players made mistakes. He also did not blame himself once-just his own players. Even most griz fans that I know noticed a BIG difference with how baby hack acted after this loss and how Kramer has acted in the past when he lost. Even at totally Bobcat functions I have been at, I have never heard Kramer say anything but good things about the griz and their program. Since day one, he has said that the griz have set the bar high and they won't be lowering it. It is up to MSU to climb up to that level.
Yes, your remarks are right on. I'll add one thing... after the O'brien incident, I was at a booster club meeting and loved Kramer's response to the whole thing. Not once did he talk down about O'brien but you could tell he ws absolutely disgusted with him. He simply stated that "Coach Obrien made a huge mistake, I wish him the best, and if he needs help I hope that he gets it. I am the head coach and I take full responsibility for this situation."
There is a huge difference in these two coaches. We can all think of times that Kramer has opened his mouth too much, or built up his players and our expectations too much, or even berated his players a bit too much. But baby hack has also berated his players and has rarely, if ever, taken any blame for a loss himself. And he rarely says anything nice about other teams, and has never said anything good about MSU to my knowledge. Kramer does have an ego, but I also sense he does care deeply about his players, especially the ones that are willing to put in the work he demands, and he is bluntly honest. Baby hack reminds me of his mentor New-weasel-enough said.

Nick · Post by **Nick** » Mon Apr 19, 2004 7:19 pm

lifeloyalmsu,

When I said Torrey Thomas, I meant Tyler.....We all know where Torrey decided to go

Okay, so Bobby called you guys "state" to add fuel to the rivalry. It seems to have worked, I don't see it as belittling the players or team personally, the rival has dated back to 1897.

I don't see how Griz fans think they're high and mighty. That could be your opinion, but when your team has backed up the talk for 17 years...

But what is it with YOU??! Cat fans seem more interested in hating the Griz than cheering for their own team......

MSU01 · Post by **MSU01** » Mon Apr 19, 2004 9:44 pm

Nick wrote:But what is it with YOU??! Cat fans seem more interested in hating the Griz than cheering for their own team......

Where is that perception coming from?

catatac · Post by **catatac** » Tue Apr 20, 2004 8:53 am

MSU01 wrote:
Nick wrote:But what is it with YOU??! Cat fans seem more interested in hating the Griz than cheering for their own team......
Where is that perception coming from?

Oh, you know MSU - that whole concept that we don't care about the playoffs, or winning any other games other than Cat\Griz. I've heard them spouting that BS for the last 2 years now. They seem to be forgetting that the last 2 Cat\Griz games were for the Big Sky Title, so of course it was the most important game of the year for us. Hopefully it comes down to that game again, or better yet, the Griz are our of the hunt by then and it's just a play-off warm-up for us!!!

Nick · Post by **Nick** » Fri Apr 23, 2004 11:49 pm

How can one not perceive that Bobcat fans spend their life hating the Griz almost as much as they do cheering for the 'Cats? Think of most of the Bobcat fans' handles on egriz. (most of them along the line of "grizh8er" etc) Your only smack has to do with the University of Montana! Any topic you bring up about another program is how much you hate the University of Montana.

EVERY Bobcat fan I talk to first brings up how much they hate the Grizzlies. But I guess when you envy your big brother's success for so long......

(jk)

By the way, a playoff warm-up?? Are you kidding me? I thought your annual September slump is warm-up enough. I wouldn't call 10-7 or 27-20 a playoff warm-up. A score like 49-3, 28-3, or 55-7 is more like it....

MSU01 · Post by **MSU01** » Sat Apr 24, 2004 8:36 pm

You seem to be generalizing a perceived hatred of UM by MSU fans based mainly on a few internet message board posters...yeah, that's sound logic! Of course the smack posts here are about UM. Most of them are started by Griz fans, and there aren't any fans of other schools that have posted here yet. What are we supposed to do, talk smack against ISU and EWU fans who as far as we can tell don't read or post on this board yet? By the way, multiple Griz fans on here have screen names like "e-rat-a-cater" and "cats-theotherwhitemeat". I can check the member list and I'm sure I'll find at least several others. If you think that the average MSU fan spends even close to as much time hating UM as cheering for MSU you're way off.

Nick · Post by **Nick** » Sun Apr 25, 2004 5:57 pm

I've had that thought in mind long before coming to this board....It's every Cat fan I run into....Who else but with sweatshirts that say "I cheer for the Bobcats and anyone playing the Grizzlies" .......That sweatshirt doesn't surprise me, it's a rivalry......But MSU fans it seems spend half their free time bashing the Griz. And of course Griz fans are going to start smack against the Bobcats on THEIR board! What are we going to start slamming Idaho??!.....Cuz we could

Obzerver · Post by **Obzerver** » Sun Apr 25, 2004 7:45 pm

MSU01, Here's one EWU fan that keeps an eye on this board...not to trash talk but to exchange info...

Cat-theotherwhitemeat · Post by **Cat-theotherwhitemeat** » Mon Apr 26, 2004 3:27 pm

MSU01 wrote:
Nick wrote:But what is it with YOU??! Cat fans seem more interested in hating the Griz than cheering for their own team......
Where is that perception coming from?

How about this...every Griz/Cat game I've been to (all but one, the past 20 years) the Griz section has a cheer that goes like this...."Montana.....Grizzlies". The MSU section(s) always have this cheer "Eat Sh!t Grizzlies, go cats go". They usually do it several times a game. I'm surprised it's not the official Kitty motto. You can't even cheer for yourself without the Griz name coming up.

I might take in a Cat game this year (when the Griz are out of town) and I'll bet I'll still hear that stupid cheer. I should be able to walk right up to the ticket window 15 minutes before game time and get somewhere between the 40 and 45 yard line, 4-5 rows up.