Kerry trashes Bush on foreign soil

'93HonoluluCat · Post by **'93HonoluluCat** » Thu Jan 06, 2005 9:43 pm

From the WaPo, comes this article.

Dude, you lost. Get. Over. It.

iaafan · Post by **iaafan** » Thu Jan 06, 2005 10:05 pm

Good for Kerry. I'm glad to see he wasn't just trashing Bush to git 'lected Prez-nit. He must've really meant it when he said Bush is a complete moron. OK, maybe he didn't say that exactly, but that was the impression I got....from both Kerry and Bush.

WYCAT · Post by **WYCAT** » Thu Jan 06, 2005 10:17 pm

Somehow I thought you might come back with a response like "good for Kerry". Thank heavens he didn't get elected.

iaafan · Post by **iaafan** » Thu Jan 06, 2005 10:20 pm

Well you didn't want him to flip-flop AGAIN did you WYCAT? Yeah, that's what I thought you'd say, too.

WYCAT · Post by **WYCAT** » Fri Jan 07, 2005 8:31 am

No iaafan, I really wish he would just shut up and do his job as a Senator. That shouldn't include bashing the President do you think????????

By the way, am I the only one who wishes El Gato wouldn't have disappeared from the board? He was great on topics like this one. In fact, I liked his input on most topics.

Cat-theotherwhitemeat · Post by **Cat-theotherwhitemeat** » Fri Jan 07, 2005 9:13 am

WYCAT wrote:No iaafan, I really wish he would just shut up and do his job as a Senator. That shouldn't include bashing the President do you think????????

By the way, am I the only one who wishes El Gato wouldn't have disappeared from the board? He was great on topics like this one. In fact, I liked his input on most topics.

I have El Gato locked up in my basement. For 1 Millions dollars you guys can have him back. In the mean time I'm having fun throwing marshmellows at him.

WYCAT · Post by **WYCAT** » Fri Jan 07, 2005 9:16 am

No meat you can keep him for a little while longer. Tell him we miss him though would you?

mslacat · Post by **mslacat** » Fri Jan 07, 2005 9:26 am

One of the basic principles that our nation was founded, was freedom of speech! I
always find it ironic when people criticize people for others for exercising their rights.
How un-American they are!! When in fact I find them to representing the very principles
that this country was founded on! As a matter of fact, only good has ever come from
intelligent discourse in this country.

Besides what is worse criticizing your president over seas, or criticizing your head
basketball coach the day before the conference season beginning.

iaafan · Post by **iaafan** » Fri Jan 07, 2005 9:39 am

The criticism of Durham came before only the sixth ever win at Weber St. Now if only the criticism of Bush could yield those same results.

Intelligent discourse? Does that mean I can't play?

WYCAT · Post by **WYCAT** » Fri Jan 07, 2005 9:42 am

mslacat wrote:One of the basic principles that our nation was founded, was freedom of speech! I
always find it ironic when people criticize people for others for exercising their rights.
How un-American they are!! When in fact I find them to representing the very principles
that this country was founded on! As a matter of fact, only good has ever come from
intelligent discourse in this country.

Besides what is worse criticizing your president over seas, or criticizing your head
basketball coach the day before the conference season beginning.

No one is argueing the merits of freedom of speech but what does it accomplish to beat the same anti-Bush drum even now for Kerry? I am not saying he is un-American just an a$$hole. And the part about only good coming out of intelligent discourse comment I don't even know where to start. First, I don't think much of what Kerry is saying/doing could be classified intelligent and second, not a bit of good can come from it.

Finally, can you really compare a US Senator publically and continually hammering his President to a bunch of Monday morning QB's on a board like this unhappy with the direction of their favorite teams BB program the day before they start conference play?

Post by **SonomaCat** » Fri Jan 07, 2005 9:44 am

WYCAT wrote:No iaafan, I really wish he would just shut up and do his job as a Senator. That shouldn't include bashing the President do you think????????

By the way, am I the only one who wishes El Gato wouldn't have disappeared from the board? He was great on topics like this one. In fact, I liked his input on most topics.

There are a pile of Republican senators, including McCain, who have essentially said the exact same things that Kerry is saying in the article. I think iaafan has a good point -- his criticisms would seem to be much more genuine now that the election is over. Perhaps he is saying what he is saying for the good of the country? He's not trying to get elected, and playing politics right now doesn't do any good for the Democrats. He doesn't even have any past mistakes to try to gloss over, so that doesn't leave him many potential insincere motivations to work from.

If we are going to bash Kerry for being so bold as to criticize the President, we certainly should be just as stern with the Republicans who are saying the same things.

Reading through the article, I think it would be hard to point to anything that Kerry said that is even mildly controversial. All of his points seem to be virtually universally accepted truths. The war hasn't been managed well up to this point (we can debate that to death, but outside of keeping a "cup half full" mentality to "support our troops" by not being critical of past administration mistakes, it seems hard to debate that point with a straight face). Rumsfeld should be replaced, at least as per many Republican senators, and our choice to discard the Geneva Convention when it didn't suit our purposes was a very dangerous step for us to take, especially in light of our torture revelations.

It seems that Kerry is just doing his job and saying what needs to be said for the good of the country.

iaafan · Post by **iaafan** » Fri Jan 07, 2005 9:50 am

You're making an assumption that Kerry is Bush-bashing. A lot of people in the US and most in the world agree with Kerry. He's telling it like it is, which has nothing to do with Bush-bashing. It's honorable. It's his nature. He's been doing this for years.

Post by **SonomaCat** » Fri Jan 07, 2005 9:57 am

I'm a little confused by the subject line of this thread. Where is the "foreign soil" component in the article? Most of the quotes appear to come from Kerry's interview on the Imus show... which is domestic.

I've also never seen a more diplomatically worded "trashing" of a person before.

Bleedinbluengold · Post by **Bleedinbluengold** » Fri Jan 07, 2005 9:57 am

Just double checking the latest numbers........................

About half the US and the world think Bush is moron. The other half does not.

Hey, if ya can't bash the Prez, who the heck can ya bash? I think it's our duty to bash public figures...maybe, just maybe, it keeps them in check (to some degree).

WYCAT · Post by **WYCAT** » Fri Jan 07, 2005 9:59 am

Being honorable is not part of Kerry's nature. That man has no values or morals that he has followed throughout his political career and I doubt his life. He has made decisions and voted continuously according to public sentiment not principles so please don't ask me to believe that comment.

And if you guys are asking me to basically thank John Kerry for what he is saying forget it. I have some major problems with how the war is progressing as well but I don't blame Bush for all of it. And iaa, it isn't much of an assumption that Kerry is Bush bashing - it is one of his favorite things to do. And BAC, continuing to hammer the president over and over is not what I would call a Senator's job. I do not believe for a second that he is saying anything for the good of the country. I believe everything he does is self-serving. Please don't try to paint John Kerry a hero I ain't buying!

One thing we can agree on though BAC is I too missed the foreign soil part. Can that be a start toward political unity?

Post by **SonomaCat** » Fri Jan 07, 2005 10:10 am

Wow WYCAT. To hear you say it, Kerry is the devil incarnate. I just can't imagine having such polarized emotions over a politician -- especially one that hasn't really done anything particularly evil in their life. Hitler I could see... but Kerry? Sure, he fought in Vietnam, but even if you disagreed with that war, you still have to give some love to the troops.

All I can say in response is, if you criticize Kerry for speaking out for his policy beliefs as an elected official in the U.S. Senate, you certainly better scream just as loud at others who are saying the exact same thing -- including McCain.

I'm not saying that Kerry is a hero for speaking out, but it ABSOLUTELY is his job as a senator to speak out on government policy. To suggest otherwise is unimaginable to me. He has a responsibility to his constituents to do so. And, in all honesty, his comments were pretty tame. I think the article also said that this was the first time he had made any comments about Iraq at all since the election? It doesn't sound like he is exactly beating a drum on this thing -- more people think he has been too quiet so far.

iaafan · Post by **iaafan** » Fri Jan 07, 2005 10:12 am

Bleedin: Only 1/2 the world thinks Bush is a moron? Is that because only half the world knows who he is?

Post by **SonomaCat** » Fri Jan 07, 2005 10:15 am

Bleedinbluengold wrote:Just double checking the latest numbers........................

About half the US and the world think Bush is moron. The other half does not.

Hey, if ya can't bash the Prez, who the heck can ya bash? I think it's our duty to bash public figures...maybe, just maybe, it keeps them in check (to some degree).

I think it is probably closer to half of the U.S. and about 75% of the world. I think the world is always going to be a bit more biased against the U.S. President than we are ourselves, though. That's just how they are.

WYCAT · Post by **WYCAT** » Fri Jan 07, 2005 10:25 am

My last post BAC (on this subject). My comments about Kerry were meant to point out a few of the reasons I am tired of you guys telling me I should thank him for Bashing Bush. He is not a great honorable man doing all he can for his country. He is your typical slimy lawyer politician that are rampant in D.C. right now, Republican and Democrat. I was mearly asking you not to paint him in a better light than that because he isn't deserving. And talk about calling someone the devil incarnate. Pot/Kettle - Kettle/Pot.

Like I said in my first post here, Thank heavens Kerry didn't get elected.

Post by **SonomaCat** » Fri Jan 07, 2005 10:30 am

WYCAT wrote:My last post BAC (on this subject). My comments about Kerry were meant to point out a few of the reasons I am tired of you guys telling me I should thank him for Bashing Bush. He is not a great honorable man doing all he can for his country. He is your typical slimy lawyer politician that are rampant in D.C. right now, Republican and Democrat. I was mearly asking you not to paint him in a better light than that because he isn't deserving. And talk about calling someone the devil incarnate. Pot/Kettle - Kettle/Pot.

Like I said in my first post here, Thank heavens Kerry didn't get elected.

You still didn't address why Kerry is bad for speaking out, but why no such criticism follows the Republicans who have said the same things.

I don't think anyone is suggesting that you should be thanking Kerry for speaking out -- I just think most people think it is wrong to chastize him for doing so.