Michael Jackson Jury Reaches Verdict

[SonomaCat]

I think an interesting next question is: Will the accusers in the criminal trial pursue civil action against MJ? I'm certainly no expert in this area, but if we do use the OJ trial as a guide, it seems like the burden of proof for a civil trial is much less than that of a criminal trial.

I agree with everyone who doubts that MJ is broke -- he has to have plenty of cash and tons of royalties from the Beatles portfolio. Will we see a rash of civil actions against him now from various former bedmates, and will the public perception that he "got away with it" this time around sow the seeds for a plaintiff-sympathetic civil jury?

I personally hope so, if for no other reason than that he gives me the creeps and I like to see him suffer. There, that effectively kills my chances for both sainthood as well as being called as a jury member for any MJ civil trials (just in case any of the victims file in SF).

[iaafan]

He gives me the creeps, too. Kind of like a witch in Salem. I mean he's icky.

[mquast53000]

Think more in terms of Asia and South America ... that's where he seems to have the biggest fanbases.

Truth be told, his music isn't bad -- he's just a freak on a human level.

and Missoula

[mslacat]

Think more in terms of Asia and South America ... that's where he seems to have the biggest fanbases.

Truth be told, his music isn't bad -- he's just a freak on a human level.

and Missoula

HEY!!!!!!!!!!!

[SonomaCat]

Apologies for heaping on the entire Slate rundown on the MJ thing, but this article, too, is really interesting. I honestly never thought about this whole thing sincerely from this perspective:

http://slate.com/id/2120889/

I actually hope this guy has it right. It's by far the best answer.

[GOKATS]

Damn interesting article, and if you think about MJ's development (or lack thereof), it seems to have some merit as to how he became a freak.

Facts are though, that if indeed he is that socially and mentally inept, he should not be allowed to freely roam the earth without being under close supervision by professionals trained to deal with such disorders.

He may think of his actions as part of "fulfilling his lost childhood", but in fact he is a 46 year old pedophile.

[briannell]

for the record it not just SoCal DA's that drop the ball on freaks, they do it here in WA state just as well. by now most regular posters know that I work with kids that have had sexual traumas using my Mastiff. there are so many incompetant DA's in Snohomish County alone that it does not surprise me that they are everywhere. try explaining to a child victim and their parents how a DA could not understand that viewing evidence prior to a judges ruling would get it thrown out of court. That the man who devastated their child will walk in about 3 months instead of the 10 years he'd likely get if the DA simply knew evidence law. it's disgusting!!
oh yeah, and also having to explain to them that the freak who did this is still allowed to live in their neighborhood once he's done his short stint in county jail. we all know MJ should be bent over and made to cry "mommy" by some Hell's Angel in prison. I'll keep my fingers crossed, because he'll get his in the end.

unfortunately it's not only the SoCal problem where DA's are concerned. As for the comment that they go into the work to "make a difference" I hope that the majority do, however, I can point you in the direction of many attorneys out for bank.

it not just defense attorney's that want money, there are many blood sucking, money grubbing attorneys that have worked for my families company, but as long as they get ours back for us, it's all good.

meat- if you're really good with computers, and don't mind relocating out of state, might I suggest SunMicrosystems it's a favorite of mine

-rebecca

[Hell's Bells]

for the record it not just SoCal DA's that drop the ball on freaks, they do it here in WA state just as well. by now most regular posters know that I work with kids that have had sexual traumas using my Mastiff. there are so many incompetant DA's in Snohomish County alone that it does not surprise me that they are everywhere. try explaining to a child victim and their parents how a DA could not understand that viewing evidence prior to a judges ruling would get it thrown out of court. That the man who devastated their child will walk in about 3 months instead of the 10 years he'd likely get if the DA simply knew evidence law. it's disgusting!!
oh yeah, and also having to explain to them that the freak who did this is still allowed to live in their neighborhood once he's done his short stint in county jail. we all know MJ should be bent over and made to cry "mommy" by some Hell's Angel in prison. I'll keep my fingers crossed, because he'll get his in the end.


-rebecca

he will get his end, trust me
is it just me or did this case seem to be a little bit on the weak side

btw 6 jurors were said to have thought mj did it but couldnt convict him because of mom dearest

[Cat-theotherwhitemeat]

meat- if you're really good with computers, and don't mind relocating out of state, might I suggest SunMicrosystems it's a favorite of mine

-rebecca

IF?

I relocated once, missed too many things--family, friends, fishing, fresh air, no lines at the ski lifts, I could go on and on. However, I never say never.

[briannell]

meat- well if it's ever a must to move away from home, Sun is a GREAT company (although bias). it was founded by great people and it trys to continue to be the kind of company employees enjoy working for.

personally, if we could have made a living in MT, we wouldn't be military. it gets retirement the quickest and by 46 we'll be living back on acreage, collecting a nice check and just enjoying ourselves.

-rebecca

[Grizlaw]

As for the comment that they go into the work to "make a difference" I hope that the majority do, however, I can point you in the direction of many attorneys out for bank.

it not just defense attorney's that want money, there are many blood sucking, money grubbing attorneys that have worked for my families company, but as long as they get ours back for us, it's all good.

My point was that I really don't think *criminal defense* attorneys, as a group, are particularly greedy people. If they were, they would have chosen a different area of the law, because unless you're really one of the truly elite criminal defense attorneys in the country, you're probably not going to get rich doing it. I know there are a lot of greedy attorneys out there, but most of them are not spending their time defending clients who have no money from petty criminal charges. The people doing *that* work are doing it because ideologically, they believe in defending the constitutional rights of the accused. You might disagree with their ideology, but you have to have some respect for them for choosing work that they believe in when they probably could have made more money doing corporate work.

And by the way -- I'm not trying to be sanctimonious here. I am a corporate tax lawyer, and I have no problem admitting that I chose this field, in part, because it pays (also because the work is a bit more intellectual, and because I don't have the stomach for criminal law). All I'm saying is that those who choose both prosecution and criminal defense as a legal specialty have my respect.

[El_Gato]

Damn interesting article, and if you think about MJ's development (or lack thereof), it seems to have some merit as to how he became a freak.

Facts are though, that if indeed he is that socially and mentally inept, he should not be allowed to freely roam the earth without being under close supervision by professionals trained to deal with such disorders.

Well stated, GK. It doesn't make the slightest difference to me WHY he became a freak with pedophilic tendencies nor how he views himself. That article is just more of the same psychobabble we hear far too often in America today; it's not his fault, you can't blame him nor hold him accountable, he's just a victim of his upbringing, blah, blah, blah... The author even starts out with a BS premise, that MJ doesn't "fit the profile" of a pedophile, as if they are all the same and can be easily identified. If we are to truly accept that MJ sees himself as a child and all his actions are childlike and therefore innocent, and that MJ is "nonsexual" as opposed to "deviant", maybe the enlightened author could explain how MJ figured out how to father a child?

The bottom line is that REGARDLESS of why he is who he is, HE IS POTENTIALLY DANGEROUS TO CHILDREN & SHOULD NEVER BE ALLOWED TO BE ALONE WITH THEM AGAIN, regardless of the verdicts.

[El_Gato]

One of my customers told me today:

"He'd have never gotten away with it if he were a black man!"

I laughed.

[SonomaCat]

Damn interesting article, and if you think about MJ's development (or lack thereof), it seems to have some merit as to how he became a freak.

Facts are though, that if indeed he is that socially and mentally inept, he should not be allowed to freely roam the earth without being under close supervision by professionals trained to deal with such disorders.

Well stated, GK. It doesn't make the slightest difference to me WHY he became a freak with pedophilic tendencies nor how he views himself. That article is just more of the same psychobabble we hear far too often in America today; it's not his fault, you can't blame him nor hold him accountable, he's just a victim of his upbringing, blah, blah, blah... The author even starts out with a BS premise, that MJ doesn't "fit the profile" of a pedophile, as if they are all the same and can be easily identified. If we are to truly accept that MJ sees himself as a child and all his actions are childlike and therefore innocent, and that MJ is "nonsexual" as opposed to "deviant", maybe the enlightened author could explain how MJ figured out how to father a child?

The bottom line is that REGARDLESS of why he is who he is, HE IS POTENTIALLY DANGEROUS TO CHILDREN & SHOULD NEVER BE ALLOWED TO BE ALONE WITH THEM AGAIN, regardless of the verdicts.

One of the premises of the article is that it is possible that he never has abused a child. That is a possibility we should definitely consider. I'll be the first to admit that I've always assumed he was guilty simply because he slept (literally) with kids. But in the context of that article, one can see a different point of view.

The truth is, none of us knows whether he is a pedophile or not. The article isn't trying to justify pedophilia, it is giving a perspective of the man that most of us haven't even considered.

You make an interesting point about him fathering a child -- clearly he isn't completely asexual (or maybe it was artificial insemination -- we are talking a freak here), but that still leaves the door open to the possibility that he just sees all of these kids as friends and not as targets of his sexual advances.

We are all "potentially" dangerous to children, but only those of us who actually intend to do harm to children should be punished. Maybe public opinion on this subject has been misled by false accusations and our natural dislike of really, really rich eccentric people. Maybe we are all wrong. Anything's possible.

I don't know, maybe MJ really is just a freak who is completely harmless, or maybe he is a freak who really is into sex with little kids. I don't know the answer.

[Hell's Bells]

honestly that is a premise i cannot accept, that he never abused a child

1) he had them in his bed and they were not his children
2) he had paid off 2 kids that thretened to bring up sexual abuse
3) all of his charged crimes seem to have a pattern

[briannell]

grizlaw - i wasn't stating that criminal defense attorneys as a whole are not doing it for "moral" reasons. I said i personally know many greedy attorneys. my brothers firm alone is packed full of them. He's in it for the money also, had his time as an Army Jag defending rapist, drunks, DV, the whole nine yards. He also sat the other side, and hell if he's going to have that much stress in his life, he ought to have a nice home to show for it. yes, all the corporate attorneys used by my extended family weren't working for SunMicrosystems or USVP for their health, they all wanted the big bucks, and they got them too!

i do respect advocates, volunteers, and those social workers involved with the underpriveleged. I work with child advocacy myself. back to my point, if MJ has these tendencies he's a freak who should be taken out of the picture. also, i have seen some of the sloppiest legal work come from local DA's. that's why many are DA's, you're not getting the cream of the crop in a DA's office (at least not in Snohomish county, WA). i'm sure the SoCal team were not legal all-stars.

as for MJ, I wasn't in his bed, i don't know what he does, or whom/what he does it with but I still think he's odd.

-rebecca

[Grizlaw]

as for MJ, I wasn't in his bed, i don't know what he does, or whom/what he does it with but I still think he's odd.

I can certainly agree that he's odd, regardless of whether or not he molested anyone.

And I'm glad to hear that you were not in his bed, Rebecca. I was wondering about that.

[briannell]

grizlaw,

the only "freaks", i'd jump into bed with (if I WERE single) are the men on the PBR tour. "real" cowboys, that like women, beer, and throwing it down on a po'd piece of beef.

yes, Brian knows! I don't go for celebs, their fakeness does nothing for me. real women like their cowboys besides as a side note - check it out, i grew up among OBSCENE amounts of money, and you can get that without being a freak! MJ is just a freak, and yes I think he really did do it, although have no proof.

-rebecca

[SonomaCat]

honestly that is a premise i cannot accept, that he never abused a child

1) he had them in his bed and they were not his children
2) he had paid off 2 kids that thretened to bring up sexual abuse
3) all of his charged crimes seem to have a pattern

Just to play devil's advocate, what would any of us rather do if we were famous and weird:

1. Go through a very, very high profile trial facing accusations (if in theory they were not true) of child molestation; or

2. Pay a couple million dollars (small part of large fortune) to make it quietly go away.

The fact that people accuse him of things and get paid off doesn't necessarily mean guilt of anything. In fact, I almost lean the opposite. If he truly was guilty of anything, wouldn't somebody along the way have taken a principled stand and cooperated with the D.A. to convict him of his crimes? Also, the fact that former people were paid off only encourages future people to do the same, which makes the current accuser all the more suspect.

It's an argument that can go either way, depending on one's mindset/bias. I can argue either side right now, which tells me that I really have no idea if he did anything or not.

I still think he's a freak, though. Of that much I am sure.

[Hell's Bells]

first of all if he had to pay off one i would be in your camp bac but 2, c'mon man first of all if i were rich and famous and someone decided to accuse me of molestation i can for one think of one better way to spend the millions: lawyer, and i would make darn sure that if they do want to go ahead and press charges they have a big fight comeing

about the only case that was suspect was the only case that got prosicuted...the da was stupid for prosecuteing that case