Stadium Expansion

gtapp · Post by **gtapp** » Tue Jun 21, 2005 10:20 pm

The athletic department is talking about stadium expansion at MSU sometime in the next few (probably 3-5) years. That would be great for recruiting but we only fill it now for Homecoming (just in the last two years) and Cat – Griz (which is every other year). Even if the Cats go 11-0 they would probably never get over 13K per game. Not even for playoffs because the weather is so cold that time of year. They need to make the stadium more attractive but making a stadium that holds 17K – 20K that would only get filled once every other year may not make sense. Now it looks full. How would it look to have 5K empty seats? We just don’t have the surrounding population of Missoula nor the following that U of M has. We won national championships in 76 and 84 and we were not short on seats during those years or the following year.

I guess we compare ourselves to Missoula too much. After U of M we have the highest attendance in the BSC by far and we are in the top 20 nation wide (for 1-AA). A better stadium would be nice but may be a waste of money if we cannot fill it on a regular basis. I would like to see a modern stadium with the bowl effect accomplished by a grass hill like U of Utah had for years (and many 1-AA stadiums as seen on anygivensaturday.com). It looks good and bowls in the stadium without adding expensive construction costs. Build a large hill of grass and trees all around the two end zones and build some seats into both end zones but let the hill connect the sides to the end zone giving a total of about 15K – 17K seats. Build tunnels from the “warming” houses to the field. Add a concession area to the top of the student section to make it look more professional and look bigger but not really be bigger. A better scoreboard would be nice with a larger and clearer video image.

Just my thoughts. Any suggestions?

Post by **kmax** » Tue Jun 21, 2005 10:52 pm

I agree with some of it and disagree with other parts.

While the immediate Bozeman area doesn't have near the people that Missoula does, it is growing leaps and bounds. There are alot of people moving to the area from out of state, many of whom enjoy watching sports. The better experience Bobcat events can be, the more likely they might just find their way to a game and enjoy themselves. Additionally, we have Butte, Helena and Billings all within a couple hours drive from here. That is more than enough population base to draw from that I don't think we should ever use that as an excuse.

Would we fill those seats? I don't know, but the fact is that they need to get rid of the endzone seats that are there, as they are just a hazard. Once you get rid of those, then you probably are getting into a crunch for seating and need to do something. The hill idea would be cool as I do like that look, but I just don't think it would be feasible. First, I just dont think it could be done on the Northwest endzone due to the locker rooms being there, unless you were going to underground some of the locker rooms and build tunnels, which sounds pretty expensive, not to mention that is the access to the field for any type of machinery that is needed(lawn mowers, emergency carts, etc.). Putting any hills on the southeast endzone would be difficult as well due to the parking areas and the track complex right behind. Connecting the endzones with those hills would also make it much more difficult and expensive for further expansions in the future.

So basically it comes down to we need to get rid of the endzone bleachers, and put up some good seats there with the knowledge and forethought of putting them in in such a way that they can easily be expanded further(full bowling in of southeast endzone) in the future if necessary. Really, I think this would be the most logical and most cost conscious move that could be made.

Just my $.02 worth though, as I obviously have no say in what actually happens.

gtapp · Post by **gtapp** » Tue Jun 21, 2005 11:04 pm

Kmax: I think there is plenty of romm in the southeast end zone for a hill but you are right about the northwest end zone. We would have to almost completely bury the locker rooms.

CARDIAC_CATS · Post by **CARDIAC_CATS** » Wed Jun 22, 2005 8:02 am

The program has grown leaps and bounds in the past few years. I bet we have averaged about at least 3,000 more per game just in the last 2 years alone. The stadium expansion would also include the club boxes for which there is also a huge waiting line for right now. You mention the cold weather in Bozeman, well the boxes would be right up a lot of people's alley for that. We do not need to add 20,000 seats in the expansion. We need to just 'tidy' up the current stadium and put boxes around like they are planning. They need to horseshoe in the south stands and add about 5,000-8,000 more seats in the south endzone as well as on the corners to go along with the boxes. This would make the capicity of the stadium about 18-23,000 or so I would think. Once we get the stadium horsehoed in, the gameday experience/sound will be GREATLY improved and thus draw more fans in as well.

If they build it, they will come. Just look at Washington Grizzly Stadium.

mquast53000 · Post by **mquast53000** » Wed Jun 22, 2005 9:00 am

I think Kmax and Cardiac Cat are right. Bozeman is growing fast, so there will be a larger population base to pull fans from in the future and the surrounding towns are showing an increase of interest (thanks impart to Kramer’s touring the state continuously). There has been a vast improvement of fan support in the last 3 years, and I think that support will continue to grow over the years. The stadium needs to replace the bleachers in the Pepsi end zone. If Pepsi wants to keep there name on that end zone make them pay some big $$$ and horseshoe it in! We don’t need 18-23K, but we could use 15,000 seats. If you get 12-13K in a 15K stadium it still looks filled, and sure would sound like it too! I know that the Athletic Dept wants to add Sky Boxes if they do anything to the stadium, so that might slow down the horseshoe idea. The reality is that selling $50 season ticket to Working Joe doesn’t interest the Athletic Dept as much as selling a Sky Box to Mr. Money Bags. There will be a harder push for Sky Boxes in the future then horse shoeing the stadium IMO.

grizhatr · Post by **grizhatr** » Wed Jun 22, 2005 10:08 am

I would have to say that the average joe is just as important to the bottom line as is the person with extra coin. The sky boxes are huge revenue because its a commitment for five years I believe. There is a waiting list for sky boxes, as many business's can write it off. Keep that in mind. Yes there are those individuals that do anty up, but most are groups of people and business's willing to "share" the cost. I do expect to see this expansion idea proceed. It is time to make the stadium a better experience and athletics is aware as well. The capital campaign will get going and will include other ammenties for the athletes at MSU too.

raincat · Post by **raincat** » Wed Jun 22, 2005 10:36 am

If additional seats are going to be added they should be located between the 10 yard lines and not in the end zone. Building a horseshoe configuration would "prettify" the stadium, but the cost/benefit of adding low price, poor view seats is inferior to adding seats that would attract additional fans/spectators who actually want to view the entire playing field. If raising the height or putting a second deck on the student side happens you disturb the mountain view....that's progress.

94VegasCat · Post by **94VegasCat** » Wed Jun 22, 2005 10:44 am

I am not a big proponent of the horseshoe idea as a whole. I think that something needs to be done on the south end zone though for sure. The east stands could be upgraded to match the west side with sky boxes and the like. On the north end, I don't think that putting in concrete castings and then burying them sounds that bad. Bury the locker rooms and put in concrete tubing for the tunnels.

Whatever happened to the idea from several years ago when they were gonna build a hotel like structure that overlooked one of the end zones and also had a study area for the athletes???

jagur1 · Post by **jagur1** » Wed Jun 22, 2005 10:44 am

Raincat have you ever sat in a good endzone seat. Yes, I miss some action on the other end.... wich I gladly give up for seeing a Wideout break open or a running back hit a hole. Plus, endzone stands on D, Touchdown catches, the list goes on and on. I thought my friend was crazy for getting endzone tickets now I see how great it is..

Post by **kmax** » Wed Jun 22, 2005 10:52 am

Gotta agree with jagur here on this one. I can still remember coming up from Billings with my parents when I was young and sitting in the old northeast endzone bleachers to watch Cat games. It was great, and the things you can see from there that you can't from the side as jagur pointed out are definately cool. The other good reason for endzone seats are the crowd factor for the game. Put some good seats in the endzone that fans actually want to be in and make some noise, and you dramatically increase the "homefield advantage" you can give your team.

Cat Pride · Post by **Cat Pride** » Wed Jun 22, 2005 11:45 am

jagur1 wrote:Raincat have you ever sat in a good endzone seat. Yes, I miss some action on the other end.... wich I gladly give up for seeing a Wideout break open or a running back hit a hole. Plus, endzone stands on D, Touchdown catches, the list goes on and on. I thought my friend was crazy for getting endzone tickets now I see how great it is..

I side with you on that jag. Best seat in your house (Wash-Griz) is the north end zone, especially if you sit in the midsection to upper section of the NEZ. That way you have more perspective on the field.

If the Cats horseshoed in the SEZ, and the seats were put right on top of the field and close to the action, I would transfer my season tickets to that area of the field instead.

jagur1 · Post by **jagur1** » Wed Jun 22, 2005 12:15 pm

Might help with the wind also, which would help your kickers. I think it might help with the Wind. Any engineers on the board.

CARDIAC_CATS · Post by **CARDIAC_CATS** » Wed Jun 22, 2005 12:46 pm

jagur1 wrote:Raincat have you ever sat in a good endzone seat. Yes, I miss some action on the other end.... wich I gladly give up for seeing a Wideout break open or a running back hit a hole. Plus, endzone stands on D, Touchdown catches, the list goes on and on. I thought my friend was crazy for getting endzone tickets now I see how great it is..

Totally agree. Both the endzone and 50 yard line seats have their good points and bad points. Each one gives you a distinct different view of the game, but the endzone you can see the RB's hit the hole/WR's beat the coverage and adjust to the ball underneath etc. I like the horseshoe idea with boxes over and on the student side. It will make the stadium more like a one piece type stadium and definately make it a more intimate atmosphere.

Cat Pride · Post by **Cat Pride** » Wed Jun 22, 2005 12:54 pm

jagur1 wrote:Might help with the wind also, which would help your kickers. I think it might help with the Wind. Any engineers on the board.

Wind blows in from the NEZ most the time, so I doubt it. The best thing to help the kicking game in Bozeman is to get some actual kickers... which I think we may finally have.

VictorG · Post by **VictorG** » Wed Jun 22, 2005 1:54 pm

Cat Pride wrote:
jagur1 wrote:Might help with the wind also, which would help your kickers. I think it might help with the Wind. Any engineers on the board.
Wind blows in from the NEZ most the time, so I doubt it. The best thing to help the kicking game in Bozeman is to get some actual kickers... which I think we may finally have.

I'm more concerned with OUR kickers! Close it up!

Cat-theotherwhitemeat · Post by **Cat-theotherwhitemeat** » Wed Jun 22, 2005 2:12 pm

How about this idea for your stadium.....

1. Take out the south bleachers completely (we all know they suck).
2. Fill in that end with a bowl of bleachers of somewhere between 15-20 rows. On top of that, add one row of sky boxes.
3. On the other end (north side), configure it so that it's one big sky box, or an enclosure with windows that open for warmer games and close for cold snowy ones. Kind of like a big bar where you sit and watch the game complete with waiters, bartenders, etc (levels that get higher the farther you get from the field). This enclosure could go above the looker rooms and hold hundreds of people. Plus, think of the money it would bring in and what a way to watch a game! Of course, they'd have to serve Oly.

4. Get a new scoreboard and video screen.
5. For God's sake, get a new sound system.
6. For good measure, spend another grand and get a less threatening suit for that mascot of yours....yikes!

Post by **kmax** » Wed Jun 22, 2005 2:20 pm

Cat-theotherwhitemeat wrote:How about this idea for your stadium.....

1. Take out the south bleachers completely (we all know they suck).
2. Fill in that end with a bowl of bleachers of somewhere between 15-20 rows. On top of that, add one row of sky boxes.
3. On the other end (north side), configure it so that it's one big sky box, or an enclosure with windows that open for warmer games and close for cold snowy ones. Kind of like a big bar where you sit and watch the game complete with waiters, bartenders, etc (levels that get higher the farther you get from the field). This enclosure could go above the looker rooms and hold hundreds of people. Plus, think of the money it would bring in and what a way to watch a game! Of course, they'd have to serve Oly.
4. Get a new scoreboard and video screen.
5. For God's sake, get a new sound system.
6. For good measure, spend another grand and get a less threatening suit for that mascot of yours....yikes!

Can't say that I see anything wrong with any of those suggestions and would be very happy if we could do those. I am assuming that once you get that great job in Billings you will be donating to help your new favorite team make these dreams become a reality, right?

Cat Pride · Post by **Cat Pride** » Wed Jun 22, 2005 2:29 pm

Or how about some end zone field level suits like the Seahawks have - those are pretty awesome! Then you can horseshoe 15-20 rows of bleacher seating above that. Pitt has something like this in their new basketball arena too.

Lets get inovative here MSU... you have a kick ass architect department (eh mslacat).

How about a new scoreboard/jumbo screen, and move them to the opposite NEZ where everyone can see it.

Cat-theotherwhitemeat · Post by **Cat-theotherwhitemeat** » Wed Jun 22, 2005 2:45 pm

Oh yeah, almost forgot. Add a bunch of trees in the parking lots around the stadium. Some evergreens and some leaf changes ones like red and sugar maples, sassafras, sumac, blackgum, sweetgum, Northern red oak, etc. Imagine what that would look like in the fall.

Kmax, don't jinx me, I have an interview coming up.

Cat Pride · Post by **Cat Pride** » Wed Jun 22, 2005 2:51 pm

Cat-theotherwhitemeat wrote:Oh yeah, almost forgot. Add a bunch of trees in the parking lots around the stadium. Some evergreens and some leaf changes ones like red and sugar maples, sassafras, sumac, blackgum, sweetgum, Northern red oak, etc. Imagine what that would look like in the fall.

Kmax, don't jinx me, I have an interview coming up.

Improvements to the parking lots around the football stadium have been beaten to death. Landscaping and pavement are a must over there. Flags, a statue or dedication to past teams, NC banners, etc make a world of difference.

I am pretty sure this is all a part of the capital improvements campaign the athletic department is kicking off.