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Dexter X wrote:
Obviously the father of the kid is happy with how it was handled.. I think that the father of the kid is a better judge of whether it was handled correctly than you, me, ..
Hauck also contacted McCarthy’s father, whom Grady describes as a big Griz fan.
You honestly think that a father would put being a fan of a football team over the well being of his own son? Do you really believe that?Hawks86 wrote:Dexter X wrote:
Obviously the father of the kid is happy with how it was handled.. I think that the father of the kid is a better judge of whether it was handled correctly than you, me, ..
Maybe the reason the father was happy with how it was handled is becauseHauck also contacted McCarthy’s father, whom Grady describes as a big Griz fan.
Are you getting dizzy yet from all of that spinning?Dexter X wrote:Oh come on Alpha, you don't actually think I believe that the other poster is you do you? He didn't go off on a nonsensical rant laden with borderline racist comments and then start arguing with himself like you do on eGriz occasionally.. so obviously I knew it wasn't youAlphaGriz1 wrote:Yeah hes one of my many screen names I have!
You got me.
Maybe you should run over to the other board, they can censor anything you dont like over there.
Truth hurts X deal with it.
Way to defend criminal activity, you big man you!One question I have for you though is... you do realize that on the other board, the guy you are agreeing with, and getting all huggy huggy with (Hairy Bear) is the same guy you scared out of a bar right (you gangster thug...)? Just thought you should know that, since the upcoming romantic date that you two obviously have planned might be kind of awkward when you meet again...
Actually, yes, I would. Obviously the father of the kid is happy with how it was handled.. I think that the father of the kid is a better judge of whether it was handled correctly than you, me, or the obviously biased Glenn Beck style "journalists" that wrote those pieces on the Kaimin.. The "pattern of violent crime" article was especially poorly written. Grizplan are you saying that You and the Kaimin know what's best for that other student, and his own father's opinion that the issue has been resolved isn't correct?Grizplan wrote:And Dexter, I would appreciate it if you would answer the question I posed. That is, would you still support the way Hauck has handled these players if he had gone 7-5 last season and missed the playoffs?
The Kaimin is taking one side of the story as the gospel truth, and then tossing in a couple tablespoons of Hauck Hatred, a cup of "waah waah the football program gets too much funding", a couple contradictory statements, mixing it all together and presenting us with these piles of crap
Didn't anyone else find it interesting that in the article by Mike Gerrity, that he uses incidents where charges were dropped, non-guilty (due to self defense) verdicts, and other non-criminal incidents as proof there is a "pattern of violent crime"? He both uses the Jimmy Wilson incident as part of his "pattern of violent crime, and as evidence that he's unbiased since he wanted Wilson to have a second chance. So..is he saying Wilson commited a violent crime? Or is he saying that Wilson should've gotten a second chance? Hm... Mike Shelton leaving Arizona..he lumps in with his "pattern of violent crime", yet there's no evidence that Shelton did anything violent or criminal at Arizona... so is there some big cover-up spanning both the U of M and Arizona over this? Yeah.. I kind of doubt that..
Do you have something to actually refute what I'm saying, or is what you just posted all you got?Grizplan wrote:Are you getting dizzy yet from all of that spinning?
Please, I'm curious to hear what you disagree with in my post. Was it me pointing out that one of the writers contradicted himself, used bad examples in his "violent patter of crimes" article, and hinted at a massive cover-up involving two states? Or was it that I think that the Father of the kid is a better judge of whether it was resolved correctly than some student journalists who have only heard one side of the story, have no hard facts, and have had axes to grind with the football program for many years? So please...do feel free to tell me why I'm wrong You are probably right about it not being reported then. So the reporters wrote their revenge piece because their feelings got a bit hurt, and Hauck will probably ignore their questions for a while. Not exactly the the scandal of the century..a coach having a spat with a reporterHawks86 wrote:It has nothing to do with the kids well being. It is my opinion that if the father of this kid is not a big griz fan, the odds of him pressing charges greatly increases. I personally think the in house punishment and apologies from all participants is proper and if Hauck doesn't go all ballistic on the Kaimin reporter this whole incident is never reported.
This is a great post...my thoughts exactlyGrizplan wrote:I sure hope that Dexter does not speak for the majority of Griz fans, of which I am one. I do not think he does. It pains me to read all of the posts on egriz from Griz fans trying to focus on whether these two players provoked the incident, etc. Instead, they should be focusing on the re-curring problem that Bobby Hauck has with criminal activities from his recruits, and his reluctance to face the issues straight-on, rather than to "handle things internally". To me, when a coach tries to keep an incident out of the media, he has problems that go much deeper than what is on the surface. I am personally ashamed of his actions related to this incident, as well as previous ones. Blasting a 20-year old student reporter with F-bombs is totally un-called for from a supposed leader of young men who is in the public eye. Winning should not supercede civility. But, it looks to me as if it does in this case. I wonder if Hauck's fan base would still support his actions if the team went 7-5 last season?
I am quite certain that there was some compensation made by Hauck to have the father pretend that this never happened. Curious that this is the second time that Hauck has interviened directly with the parent of the offended, only to have that individual suddenly say flowery things about Bobby and the offending players. If it looks like a rat, and smells like a rat.......well, you know the rest of that story.WeedKillinCat wrote:This is a great post...my thoughts exactlyGrizplan wrote:I sure hope that Dexter does not speak for the majority of Griz fans, of which I am one. I do not think he does. It pains me to read all of the posts on egriz from Griz fans trying to focus on whether these two players provoked the incident, etc. Instead, they should be focusing on the re-curring problem that Bobby Hauck has with criminal activities from his recruits, and his reluctance to face the issues straight-on, rather than to "handle things internally". To me, when a coach tries to keep an incident out of the media, he has problems that go much deeper than what is on the surface. I am personally ashamed of his actions related to this incident, as well as previous ones. Blasting a 20-year old student reporter with F-bombs is totally un-called for from a supposed leader of young men who is in the public eye. Winning should not supercede civility. But, it looks to me as if it does in this case. I wonder if Hauck's fan base would still support his actions if the team went 7-5 last season?
If the boy's father is a big Griz fan you have to wonder if it was handled with 50 yardline tickets for life
As I remember that incident it was reported in a paper, there was some indication by MSU that it was being handled internally by the team, It was public knowledge and done and over with, This story on the other hand was covered up, your coach has a meeting with the victims father and reaches a settlment to keep this thing quiet, and while there was some diciplinary action there was no response to public inquiry by UM, when asked about it your coach throws obsenities at a student reporter. The severity of the incidents is simular, the managment of the incident by your coach is what makes this incident worse for your program.BDizzle wrote:I have a question for everyone. Earlier (can't remember if it was this summer or last spring) it is known that a prominent Bobcat football player got into a fight and kicked the crap out of a kid. It is rumored that he didn't start the fight but he was still involved and this wasn't the first time that he has had trouble. People were sticking up for him and how the Bobcats handled the incident. Now the almost exact same thing happenes to some Griz players and some of you are acting like its the end of the world. There have been many comments that say "good thing this isn't happening in our program anymore" when we know that it has happened to you guys to. I'm not happy with what happened as I was just talking about how Swink seems like a good guy that is up here playing football and minding his own business. I could go on and on about how these kids made a horrible decision and should be smarter and if it was ok or not for the Kaimin to report this. But my question is why was the punishment ok for a Bobcat player but an even more severe punishment IMO is not ok for a Griz player when from the facts it seems like the incident is almost identical?
PlayerRep wrote:The point is not the record of the teams UM beat, it's the quality and record of the teams UM almost beat.
I agree with the fact that Hauck should not cuss at a reporter no matter how annoyed he is. But I don't believe that UM covered up the incident. It was a fight and there were no charges filed so it wouldn't be in the paper. You and I have no idea what happened between Hauck and the father. I know if I was talking sh*t to somebody and they kicked my butt my dad would probably tell me I deserved it and to be smarter next time. I actually wouldn't expect an apology. Kicking a guy when he is down is cheap but in the heat of the moment it does happen. I've seen quite a few fights in my life and most of them don't end as soon as somebody goes to the ground. The only reason this became a big deal is because the Kaimin reported it months after it happened and everything seemed to be resolved. If the Kaimin wouldn't of reported this this incident would of been exactly like the Bobcat incident. I believe everything was handled correctly until Bobby got pissed at the reporter.cats2506 wrote:As I remember that incident it was reported in a paper, there was some indication by MSU that it was being handled internally by the team, It was public knowledge and done and over with, This story on the other hand was covered up, your coach has a meeting with the victims father and reaches a settlment to keep this thing quiet, and while there was some diciplinary action there was no response to public inquiry by UM, when asked about it your coach throws obsenities at a student reporter. The severity of the incidents is simular, the managment of the incident by your coach is what makes this incident worse for your program.BDizzle wrote:I have a question for everyone. Earlier (can't remember if it was this summer or last spring) it is known that a prominent Bobcat football player got into a fight and kicked the crap out of a kid. It is rumored that he didn't start the fight but he was still involved and this wasn't the first time that he has had trouble. People were sticking up for him and how the Bobcats handled the incident. Now the almost exact same thing happenes to some Griz players and some of you are acting like its the end of the world. There have been many comments that say "good thing this isn't happening in our program anymore" when we know that it has happened to you guys to. I'm not happy with what happened as I was just talking about how Swink seems like a good guy that is up here playing football and minding his own business. I could go on and on about how these kids made a horrible decision and should be smarter and if it was ok or not for the Kaimin to report this. But my question is why was the punishment ok for a Bobcat player but an even more severe punishment IMO is not ok for a Griz player when from the facts it seems like the incident is almost identical?
This was kept quiet, wasnt public knoledge for many months, that is why it has the appearance of a coverup. That is why the Kaimin went after it and because they were going to make it public is why bobby went off. You cant say that bobby didnt try to keep this from the public and he was successfull for several months, - coverup.BDizzle wrote:I agree with the fact that Hauck should not cuss at a reporter no matter how annoyed he is. But I don't believe that UM covered up the incident. It was a fight and there were no charges filed so it wouldn't be in the paper. You and I have no idea what happened between Hauck and the father. I know if I was talking sh*t to somebody and they kicked my butt my dad would probably tell me I deserved it and to be smarter next time. I actually wouldn't expect an apology. Kicking a guy when he is down is cheap but in the heat of the moment it does happen. I've seen quite a few fights in my life and most of them don't end as soon as somebody goes to the ground. The only reason this became a big deal is because the Kaimin reported it months after it happened and everything seemed to be resolved. If the Kaimin wouldn't of reported this this incident would of been exactly like the Bobcat incident. I believe everything was handled correctly until Bobby got pissed at the reporter.cats2506 wrote:As I remember that incident it was reported in a paper, there was some indication by MSU that it was being handled internally by the team, It was public knowledge and done and over with, This story on the other hand was covered up, your coach has a meeting with the victims father and reaches a settlment to keep this thing quiet, and while there was some diciplinary action there was no response to public inquiry by UM, when asked about it your coach throws obsenities at a student reporter. The severity of the incidents is simular, the managment of the incident by your coach is what makes this incident worse for your program.BDizzle wrote:I have a question for everyone. Earlier (can't remember if it was this summer or last spring) it is known that a prominent Bobcat football player got into a fight and kicked the crap out of a kid. It is rumored that he didn't start the fight but he was still involved and this wasn't the first time that he has had trouble. People were sticking up for him and how the Bobcats handled the incident. Now the almost exact same thing happenes to some Griz players and some of you are acting like its the end of the world. There have been many comments that say "good thing this isn't happening in our program anymore" when we know that it has happened to you guys to. I'm not happy with what happened as I was just talking about how Swink seems like a good guy that is up here playing football and minding his own business. I could go on and on about how these kids made a horrible decision and should be smarter and if it was ok or not for the Kaimin to report this. But my question is why was the punishment ok for a Bobcat player but an even more severe punishment IMO is not ok for a Griz player when from the facts it seems like the incident is almost identical?
PlayerRep wrote:The point is not the record of the teams UM beat, it's the quality and record of the teams UM almost beat.
In all fairness, I was sick when Kramer was fired, I was also sick of the problems we were having but had a hard time hanging it all on Kramer, I think a bigger issue that MSU had was the APR issue and that was primary reason he was fired. Looking back now, it is the head coach that must take the responsibility for these things. While incidents will happen on any team the volume and severity of them is what is determined by the team culture that is set by the head coach. I thnk that um has a problem with team culture but I dont believe that BH will ever be fired. With his problems he will not get a FBS HC job either, I think you are stuck with him for a long time unless he decides to take an assistants job somewhere.Grizplan wrote:You see how my fellow Griz fans continue to focus on this incident, instead of focusing on the re-curring pattern of Griz football player violence which happens every year with Hauck's recruits. Who cares if the kid's dad says everything is now peachy-keen between him and Hauck? The incident happened, AGAIN and AGAIN and AGAIN, year-after-year. When will my fellow fans say ENOUGH!
We have already been on Sportscenter for the three thugs who pistol-whipped that person after robbing him. Our program has been soiled over and over again by Hauck's recruits. Kramer was fired over less. Hauck should be fired too!
PlayerRep wrote:The point is not the record of the teams UM beat, it's the quality and record of the teams UM almost beat.
Unfortunately, I think you are right. Winning seems to cure all ills. But, if he ever starts missing the playoffs, the vultures will be circling.cats2506 wrote:In all fairness, I was sick when Kramer was fired, I was also sick of the problems we were having but had a hard time hanging it all on Kramer, I think a bigger issue that MSU had was the APR issue and that was primary reason he was fired. Looking back now, it is the head coach that must take the responsibility for these things. While incidents will happen on any team the volume and severity of them is what is determined by the team culture that is set by the head coach. I thnk that um has a problem with team culture but I dont believe that BH will ever be fired. With his problems he will not get a FBS HC job either, I think you are stuck with him for a long time unless he decides to take an assistants job somewhere.Grizplan wrote:You see how my fellow Griz fans continue to focus on this incident, instead of focusing on the re-curring pattern of Griz football player violence which happens every year with Hauck's recruits. Who cares if the kid's dad says everything is now peachy-keen between him and Hauck? The incident happened, AGAIN and AGAIN and AGAIN, year-after-year. When will my fellow fans say ENOUGH!
We have already been on Sportscenter for the three thugs who pistol-whipped that person after robbing him. Our program has been soiled over and over again by Hauck's recruits. Kramer was fired over less. Hauck should be fired too!
good post. it's hypocracy, and a little embarrassing. basically what i have learned reading this thread is a fight in which a griz is involved is worse than a fight in which a cat is involved. i also learned that if the cops are called, and the incident is reported in the paper, that makes it BETTER, and less of a "cover up" than if a fight occured and no authorities were called. the fact is these guys have a great opportunity to play football and get free school. it's a gift. if you screw with it you should be done. after these guys beat the crap out of this guy they should have been off the team. although, if you kick the crap out of someone on the 4th of july you should be off the team. if you murder someone you should be off the team. if you break into a home you should be off the team. if you decide to be underage and steal beer froma store you should be off the team. if you drink and drive you should be off the team. if you beat up a girl outside of the dorms you should be off of the team. if you sell drugs you should be off the team. if you tie someone up and rob them you should be off the team. i know kids will be kids. but i'm constantly amazed at how people justify what these guys are doing. especially "older" guys who aren't hanging out with these kids in the bars and at house parties. i understand that because they are cats and griz that some fans refuse to believe that they can't do anything wrong...but that is simply not fact. i love the cats, but there have been many cat players over the years who i couldn't stand. they were complete tools. some were just meat heads. just because you root for a team doesn't mean you need to justify what everyone on that team does....especially when you know it was wrong.BDizzle wrote:I have a question for everyone. Earlier (can't remember if it was this summer or last spring) it is known that a prominent Bobcat football player got into a fight and kicked the crap out of a kid. It is rumored that he didn't start the fight but he was still involved and this wasn't the first time that he has had trouble. People were sticking up for him and how the Bobcats handled the incident. Now the almost exact same thing happenes to some Griz players and some of you are acting like its the end of the world. There have been many comments that say "good thing this isn't happening in our program anymore" when we know that it has happened to you guys to. I'm not happy with what happened as I was just talking about how Swink seems like a good guy that is up here playing football and minding his own business. I could go on and on about how these kids made a horrible decision and should be smarter and if it was ok or not for the Kaimin to report this. But my question is why was the punishment ok for a Bobcat player but an even more severe punishment IMO is not ok for a Griz player when from the facts it seems like the incident is almost identical?
Where does anyone say that what the Cat players did was any better or worse than this? Where does anyone say that because MSU’s problems made the papers it was then "OK"?whitetrashgriz wrote:good post. it's hypocracy, and a little embarrassing. basically what i have learned reading this thread is a fight in which a griz is involved is worse than a fight in which a cat is involved. i also learned that if the cops are called, and the incident is reported in the paper, that makes it BETTER, and less of a "cover up" than if a fight occured and no authorities were called. the fact is these guys have a great opportunity to play football and get free school. it's a gift. if you screw with it you should be done. after these guys beat the crap out of this guy they should have been off the team. although, if you kick the crap out of someone on the 4th of july you should be off the team. if you murder someone you should be off the team. if you break into a home you should be off the team. if you decide to be underage and steal beer froma store you should be off the team. if you drink and drive you should be off the team. if you beat up a girl outside of the dorms you should be off of the team. if you sell drugs you should be off the team. if you tie someone up and rob them you should be off the team. i know kids will be kids. but i'm constantly amazed at how people justify what these guys are doing. especially "older" guys who aren't hanging out with these kids in the bars and at house parties. i understand that because they are cats and griz that some fans refuse to believe that they can't do anything wrong...but that is simply not fact. i love the cats, but there have been many cat players over the years who i couldn't stand. they were complete tools. some were just meat heads. just because you root for a team doesn't mean you need to justify what everyone on that team does....especially when you know it was wrong.BDizzle wrote:I have a question for everyone. Earlier (can't remember if it was this summer or last spring) it is known that a prominent Bobcat football player got into a fight and kicked the crap out of a kid. It is rumored that he didn't start the fight but he was still involved and this wasn't the first time that he has had trouble. People were sticking up for him and how the Bobcats handled the incident. Now the almost exact same thing happenes to some Griz players and some of you are acting like its the end of the world. There have been many comments that say "good thing this isn't happening in our program anymore" when we know that it has happened to you guys to. I'm not happy with what happened as I was just talking about how Swink seems like a good guy that is up here playing football and minding his own business. I could go on and on about how these kids made a horrible decision and should be smarter and if it was ok or not for the Kaimin to report this. But my question is why was the punishment ok for a Bobcat player but an even more severe punishment IMO is not ok for a Griz player when from the facts it seems like the incident is almost identical?
PlayerRep wrote:The point is not the record of the teams UM beat, it's the quality and record of the teams UM almost beat.
my reading is just fine thanks. maybe you know way more than me about this incident. if the police weren't called, what did you want bobby to do? hold a press conference? how is it a cover up? and as i stated, if it is in fact a cover up, than you are in for a rude awakening. would you like me to list all of the infractions by current and former cats that weren't reported in the paper but were handled within the team? that was my whole point. many people on this board who only know these players by what they do on the football field on saturday afternoons have no clue about the real personalities of the players. i'm not saying many of them are bad guys, but i am saying that there have been many over the years that did stupid things. i have nung out with and lived with many of the former players. most were great but some were complete jackasses in every sense of the word. it's amazing how some fans refuse to accept that. there are 4 pages on egriz around this incident and many of them are justifying what was done. and maybe the fight was justifiable. no one knows unless they were there. just like no one knew about gazzeros incident unless they were there. and the only reason that i came to the conclusion that griz getting into fights is worse than cats is because we have current players who have had their own problems with the law, as well as being in fights, yet some on here (never said you) act like this griz incident is worse. there is no point to thins thread if you really feel like it's the same thing we have going on on our own team. like i said, maybe you were there. all i can go by is first hand experince, and my first hand experience is that while there are many great kids that play for the cats and griz, there are also a lot of clowns that get in trouble, get in fights, and break the law. some people accept this. others act like it can't be possible, and focus on the other teams problems rather than their own.cats2506 wrote:Where does anyone say that what the Cat players did was any better or worse than this? Where does anyone say that because MSU’s problems made the papers it was then "OK"?whitetrashgriz wrote:good post. it's hypocracy, and a little embarrassing. basically what i have learned reading this thread is a fight in which a griz is involved is worse than a fight in which a cat is involved. i also learned that if the cops are called, and the incident is reported in the paper, that makes it BETTER, and less of a "cover up" than if a fight occured and no authorities were called. the fact is these guys have a great opportunity to play football and get free school. it's a gift. if you screw with it you should be done. after these guys beat the crap out of this guy they should have been off the team. although, if you kick the crap out of someone on the 4th of july you should be off the team. if you murder someone you should be off the team. if you break into a home you should be off the team. if you decide to be underage and steal beer froma store you should be off the team. if you drink and drive you should be off the team. if you beat up a girl outside of the dorms you should be off of the team. if you sell drugs you should be off the team. if you tie someone up and rob them you should be off the team. i know kids will be kids. but i'm constantly amazed at how people justify what these guys are doing. especially "older" guys who aren't hanging out with these kids in the bars and at house parties. i understand that because they are cats and griz that some fans refuse to believe that they can't do anything wrong...but that is simply not fact. i love the cats, but there have been many cat players over the years who i couldn't stand. they were complete tools. some were just meat heads. just because you root for a team doesn't mean you need to justify what everyone on that team does....especially when you know it was wrong.BDizzle wrote:I have a question for everyone. Earlier (can't remember if it was this summer or last spring) it is known that a prominent Bobcat football player got into a fight and kicked the crap out of a kid. It is rumored that he didn't start the fight but he was still involved and this wasn't the first time that he has had trouble. People were sticking up for him and how the Bobcats handled the incident. Now the almost exact same thing happenes to some Griz players and some of you are acting like its the end of the world. There have been many comments that say "good thing this isn't happening in our program anymore" when we know that it has happened to you guys to. I'm not happy with what happened as I was just talking about how Swink seems like a good guy that is up here playing football and minding his own business. I could go on and on about how these kids made a horrible decision and should be smarter and if it was ok or not for the Kaimin to report this. But my question is why was the punishment ok for a Bobcat player but an even more severe punishment IMO is not ok for a Griz player when from the facts it seems like the incident is almost identical?
You may have learned a lot but maybe you should reread what was written and you will learn something else.
My point was that bye hiding it BH made it worse. By acknowledging it Ash was able to get by it. By going off on a student reporter BH caused a bigger problem for his program. I never said that their CB should have more or less discipline, I just said that I think they have a problem with the culture of their team and it showed today when #2 (the same guy we are talking about) got a taunting call and laughed about it to his teammates while pointing at the flag.
The issue is not so much what the players did but how it was handled by the coaches.
I disagree that any infraction of any rule should be dismissal from the team.
