VERY BAD NEWS! Brandon Miller accused of murder

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catmom
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Post by catmom » Mon Jul 03, 2006 11:56 am

CatGrad00 wrote:
whitetrashgriz wrote:one thing has bothered me in this whole thread. well, not really, but there is one in particular that has actually bothered me for a long time. i will use catmom as an example, but i don't know her, and i am in no way trying to discredit her or take any personal jabs. but from a local guy, who grew up playing basketball, and went to msu, and hung out with a majority of football and basketball, here is my opinion. we are all cat fans here. we love to support these kids on the field or court, and wish them the best off of campus. however, there are many people that go one step farther, and try to be best friends with all of these athletes. they put these players on pedastals, as if they are celebrities. i could be way off here, but to me it seems a little weird that a family that has no relationship ties to an msu athlete, feels the need to hang out with them, and have them in their homes. maybe not a bad thing, but to me seems a little different. and as a pretty new father, i can't imagine that in 10 or 15 years when i have kids in highschool, and my wife and i will be in our 30's and forties that we will be hanging out with kids barely older than my own children! and as a man in his forties, i would think people would ge a weird vibe if i was hanging out with 19 year old girls on the basketball team! all that being said, here's where there is a major communication flaw. athletes are almost always very kind, softspoken, and polite to adult fans, boosters, teachers, and anyone else older in the community. but i have personally seen many athletes that were flat out asses come through our program, and i knew it, their temamates knew it, as well as everyone else that is our age. yet these older parents and fans only see these kids being respectful and polite. after the games, these kids visit with the fans, and are always nothing but great. but what about an hour later when they are at the parties with other COLLEGE KIDS! this is where kids are more comfortable, and this is where you can see a person for how he really is. again, i don't know catmom, and i'm not trying to come down on her, but i have seen this every year, with many, many athletes. they are not all bad, there are many really good people, but we are kidding ourselves if we assume that because they are nice to aunt sally and polite to grandma sue, that they are outstanding young men and women all the time. :idea:
GREAT POINT....alittle weird I think!
The last thing about this whole issue. Do you not think I can smell BS when it is right in front of me. Frank Brown started out as one of the kids that came over. He was new to the team and we were all trying to feel him out. He came over twice and that was it. He acted as if he deserved our generiousity. The other boys didn't like it and he was left out without me or anyone in my family having to say one thing. I also saw what was coming with that kid and tried to have older players talk with him. There is nothing you can do if they don't listen. There are a selected few that are regulars that come over. The a-holes that you talk about are quickly weeded out (if ever allowed to come over). I already have a few new kids that I know about that are already not ever coming into my home. So, there you are. Think what you want. Family dinners, sporting events and holidays. All including card games, dominos, football games in the backyard and basketball games in the front and boardgames. If you think that these kids can fool me for years about who they actually are, you are sadly mistaken. My house is a privilege not a given.

I can tell you another thing, no one that was close with Branden (that I have spoke with) saw this coming.



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Post by CatGrad00 » Mon Jul 03, 2006 1:09 pm

catmom wrote:
CatGrad00 wrote:
whitetrashgriz wrote:one thing has bothered me in this whole thread. well, not really, but there is one in particular that has actually bothered me for a long time. i will use catmom as an example, but i don't know her, and i am in no way trying to discredit her or take any personal jabs. but from a local guy, who grew up playing basketball, and went to msu, and hung out with a majority of football and basketball, here is my opinion. we are all cat fans here. we love to support these kids on the field or court, and wish them the best off of campus. however, there are many people that go one step farther, and try to be best friends with all of these athletes. they put these players on pedastals, as if they are celebrities. i could be way off here, but to me it seems a little weird that a family that has no relationship ties to an msu athlete, feels the need to hang out with them, and have them in their homes. maybe not a bad thing, but to me seems a little different. and as a pretty new father, i can't imagine that in 10 or 15 years when i have kids in highschool, and my wife and i will be in our 30's and forties that we will be hanging out with kids barely older than my own children! and as a man in his forties, i would think people would ge a weird vibe if i was hanging out with 19 year old girls on the basketball team! all that being said, here's where there is a major communication flaw. athletes are almost always very kind, softspoken, and polite to adult fans, boosters, teachers, and anyone else older in the community. but i have personally seen many athletes that were flat out asses come through our program, and i knew it, their temamates knew it, as well as everyone else that is our age. yet these older parents and fans only see these kids being respectful and polite. after the games, these kids visit with the fans, and are always nothing but great. but what about an hour later when they are at the parties with other COLLEGE KIDS! this is where kids are more comfortable, and this is where you can see a person for how he really is. again, i don't know catmom, and i'm not trying to come down on her, but i have seen this every year, with many, many athletes. they are not all bad, there are many really good people, but we are kidding ourselves if we assume that because they are nice to aunt sally and polite to grandma sue, that they are outstanding young men and women all the time. :idea:
GREAT POINT....alittle weird I think!
The last thing about this whole issue. Do you not think I can smell BS when it is right in front of me. Frank Brown started out as one of the kids that came over. He was new to the team and we were all trying to feel him out. He came over twice and that was it. He acted as if he deserved our generiousity. The other boys didn't like it and he was left out without me or anyone in my family having to say one thing. I also saw what was coming with that kid and tried to have older players talk with him. There is nothing you can do if they don't listen. There are a selected few that are regulars that come over. The a-holes that you talk about are quickly weeded out (if ever allowed to come over). I already have a few new kids that I know about that are already not ever coming into my home. So, there you are. Think what you want. Family dinners, sporting events and holidays. All including card games, dominos, football games in the backyard and basketball games in the front and boardgames. If you think that these kids can fool me for years about who they actually are, you are sadly mistaken. My house is a privilege not a given.

I can tell you another thing, no one that was close with Branden (that I have spoke with) saw this coming.
This is still weird



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Post by tetoncat » Mon Jul 03, 2006 1:18 pm

I don't understand why you think this is so weird. Minor league baseball players in Montana are housed most of the time. Their "family" attends most of their games and feeds and houses them during the summer. Most do it to get to know these kids and their love of baseball. Cat mom and others like her see a need to give a family presence to these athletes that most do not h ave because of the distance home. Other students probably go home with their roomates, friends etc. but a lot of times the athletes need to stay on campus for practice or upcoming games. This gives them a spot to go at least once in a while.


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Post by crazycat » Mon Jul 03, 2006 1:18 pm

I don't think it's weird. Just about every town has a person like catmom. These are simply people with a keen interest in sports that also understand that some of the players have come a long way from home and might like to have a home away from home. All the Pioneer League baseball teams have programs to house players and a lot of these folks have been doing this for years. Of those there's always a few, like catmom, that give a little extra, but have no ulterior motive. Look at it as being a good Samaritan.



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Post by catmom » Mon Jul 03, 2006 1:23 pm

thank you Crazycat and Tetoncat. I'm glad someone out there gets it. :P



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Post by MSU01 » Mon Jul 03, 2006 1:43 pm

catmom wrote:I'm glad someone out there gets it. :P
I get it too. Thanks for everything you do to help these young men and women!



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Post by SonomaCat » Mon Jul 03, 2006 1:57 pm

I find it weird that anyone would criticize the selflessness of others, personally.



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Post by bobcatgrad2005 » Wed Jul 05, 2006 2:51 pm

Regarding the "How many of these athletes graduate" question:

By the fall semester of 2006, all but 2 of the guys who played or suited up for their senior year of eligiablity for Bobcat football since 2000 will have graduated.

The remaining 2" Travis Lulay and Adam Cordiero.

I consider that a sucessfull statistic.



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Post by old wise one » Wed Jul 05, 2006 3:50 pm

grad 2005, where did you hear that?



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Post by jagur1 » Wed Jul 05, 2006 3:53 pm

But what about all the guys that suited up for Freshman, Soph, junior years that didn't suit up for the Senior year. What is the % on that one. You only wish the NCAA kept Graduation rates according to those who make it 4 years.


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Post by irishcat23 » Wed Jul 05, 2006 3:57 pm

I've personally enjoyed several lovely dinners at Catmom's home with her and her family. And I'm not an athelete. And I'm a chick. Yes, she provides a home away from home for SOME of these kids but there's not just an open invitation to anyone. Get off her back.

I'd also like to say that as far as determining whether or not Branden and Freak are good people is no one's place. I'm perfectly content leaving that one up to the Big Guy. Now please, let's move on.



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Post by mslacat » Wed Jul 05, 2006 3:57 pm

Found on the Net:

A perspective

http://www.insidehighered.com/news/2006/07/05/msu
Asking Tough Questions
When former athletes of college teams get in trouble with the law, the institutions they attended usually react minimally if at all. Someone in sports information will confirm the dates that a person was on a team or enrolled, stress that the recently arrested person is no longer a student, and pretty much leave it at that.


Montana State University might have had a hard time just moving on in that way when news broke last week about the arrests of two of its former athletes. The charge was murder and the body of the victim, reportedly a cocaine dealer, was found on a campus farm. But whether it was the nature of the crime, the fallout from the Duke University lacrosse scandal, or some combination of factors, the university’s response has been striking.

While stressing that anyone who committed murder is responsible for such an act, the president of the university started acting within a day of the arrests, issuing statements and giving interviews, announcing plans for an outside review of athletics, focusing on recruiting practices, and insisting that Montana State “take a serious look” at itself.

On Monday, President Geoff Gamble sent an e-mail to all students and faculty members, telling them that the arrested ex-students could face the death penalty and that more arrests are possible. While his note did not say so, several sources said that those additional arrests are likely to involve other former athletes at the university.

“This incident is the most serious one I’ve encountered in my many years of higher education,” Gamble wrote. “It troubles me and I felt a responsibility to communicate with you about this. I have felt a range of emotions in the last several days — sadness, distress, disappointment and disbelief. I suspect that each of you may have experienced many of the same feelings.”

The two men arrested — Branden Miller and John LeBrum — are both 22 and both are being held in jail. They and their lawyers have not commented on the charges. But Montana newspapers have been full of reports, since their arrests Thursday, about how police linked them to Jason Cody Wright, whose body was found in one of Montana State’s agronomy fields. He had been shot. Papers filed by law enforcement officials indicate that Wright was a cocaine dealer — and the scandal may grow in part because police recovered detailed sales records from Wright’s home.

Miller enrolled at Montana State in the fall of 2004 and was one of the top players on the basketball team until he was forced to leave the team in December 2005 because his academic performance fell below minimum requirements. He withdrew from the university in April. LeBrum was a student and a member of the football team during the 2003-4 academic year, but left the university after he was dismissed from the team for disciplinary reasons.

Montana State may not be a sports powerhouse nationally, but fans in Bozeman and throughout the state care deeply about how the Bobcats fare. Off the field, athletes perform well, with their graduation rates exceeding those of the student body as a whole. Team rosters are split between Montana residents and those from out of state. Miller and LeBrum are from out of state.

In an interview Monday, Gamble said that one of the areas he most wants to focus on is how and why athletes are recruited, and whether enough emphasis is placed on their non-athletic skills and qualities. “When we bring an athlete to campus, does he or she have a high chance of success academically? It makes no sense to bring someone who has a low chance of success,” he said.

Gamble meets with the coaching and athletics staff at Montana State at least annually to talk about university priorities, and he said he has made it clear that — if the cost of winning is recruiting students who can’t perform academically — he’s willing to take more losses.

With 60 percent of athletes having grade-point averages above 3.0 — and a good number of averages in the A range — Gamble said that he thinks the system “is working well at the high end.” His worry, he said, is that for some students being recruited, there may not be enough emphasis on “fit” with the university’s academic requirements and values.

Athletics staff members say that they already pay a lot of attention to those issues. In an interview with the Associated Press, the basketball coach who recruited Miller said that he had no indications of any problems and that current recruiting practices are sufficient.

Gamble said that he had no evidence that anything wasn’t being done properly — except for the rather glaring evidence of the last week. “Having former students arrested for murder is unprecedented,” he said. “You have to step back and ask if we are doing everything we should,” he said. Part of that process, he said, needs to be “fresh eyes,” which is why he is planning to bring in an outside consultant to review the situation.

Then there is the question of drugs. Gamble said that the fact that former students may be involved in a “drug culture” is of great concern. In March, eight freshmen at Montana State — none of them athletes — were arrested on charges including distribution and possession of cocaine, ecstacy, hallucinogenic mushrooms and marijuana. The students were all suspended and evicted from their dormitory rooms. While meth is not a problem at Montana State, Gamble said he has served on a state task force looking at its growing prevalence in in the state — including some of the most rural areas.

“When you see an underlying drug culture, you have to ask whether you are sending a strong enough message,” Gamble said.

Montana State may be facing the first serious scandal involving athletes’ behavior to emerge since the Duke lacrosse scandal, and Gamble said that he has read all of the reports Duke put out about how it responded to the situation (or in some cases, failed initially to respond). A Duke report criticized many at the university for failing to fully inform the president there of the incident and the nature of the allegations — and Gamble said that there has been no holding back at Montana State, from the day the arrests were made. Gamble has also stressed the importance of making it clear to athletes that they need to cooperate fully with law enforcement and to talk to coaches and senior officials about any problems they see.

Raising that issue early may sound like a response to Duke, where lacrosse players were accused early on (before many doubts surfaced about the allegations) of protecting one another.

In fact, Gamble said he has been influenced by a previous athletic scandal, but not the one at Duke. Before he came to Montana State, he was provost at the University of Vermont, where hazing allegations involving the hockey team in 1999 were determined to be true — and an attorney general’s report documented the way players worked together to lie about what had happened. “I’ve seen how quickly these things can get bolluxed up,” he said.

Another issue at Montana State — one people are talking about quite a bit privately, but not much publicly — is race. Both of the ex-students who were arrested are black. The black population in the state of Montana is so small (less than 1 percent) that there are very few black students at the university — totals vary from year to year and can be measured in the dozens — and the overwhelming majority of black students at Montana State are athletes.

Asked about the message sent on a campus where most black students are athletes, Gamble said that was “an intriguing question,” but added that “the issue about racial and cultural background isn’t as important to me as probability for success as a student and then success as a student athlete.”

Peter Fields, the athletics director at Montana State, said he knows that ‘there are people who will make race an issue — but for me it’s a larger issue.” To those who suggest that Montana State not recruit in certain kinds of communities (defined in various socioeconomic terms), Fields noted the growing meth problem in Montana. “Do we stop recruiting in areas where there are some people who choose to make meth?” he asked. “We need to make sure that we are recruiting students who happen to be good athletes.”

At the same time, Fields said there are more pressures on black athletes at Montana State, even if those are a reflection of the pressures on all athletes in a state where the programs at Montana State and the University of Montana are the big time. “Whatever happens in this town of 30,000, we live in a glass house. If you are an African American and you live in this glass house, it’s even more magnified,” he said.

And that may exacerbate the difficulties. “I’m so saddened to think that these two made such a horrendous decision and that it may reflect on the many good minority students we have here,” he said.

Field said it was too early to outline reforms the university might make. But he said that there is already discussion of recruiting practices, the level of academic support and monitoring of athletes, and some questions being asked about doing background checks on prospective athletes.

Having read the Duke reports, Field said he was anxious to be sure everyone knew that the university was taking this seriously, listening to everyone, and committed to making any needed changes. “One of the things I took away was a disconnect between when the university responded and when the event happened and was seen as important in the community,” Field said. “We want to be pro-active.”

At the same time, he acknowledged, it can be hard for people to focus when everyone is still so stunned by the murder and the arrests.

Field met with basketball players right after the arrests. “They had been diving on the floor with Branden Miller for almost two years,” he said. “I don’t think they ever considered that this could be part of his make-up. Our whole department has been in shock.”


You elected a ****** RAPIST to be our President

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Post by SonomaCat » Wed Jul 05, 2006 4:11 pm

Interesting article. What publication was that pulled from? I didn't see any references in it.



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Post by mslacat » Wed Jul 05, 2006 4:17 pm

Bay Area Cat wrote:Interesting article. What publication was that pulled from? I didn't see any references in it.
Go to the link is the best advise I can give you. It appears to be an education oriented pub.

I have been Googling "Braden Miller" in their news section every so often to just check out if any new news has come out. That came up last I checked. It was a little different than alot of the fare I have seen so I posted it.


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Post by LTown Cat » Wed Jul 05, 2006 4:20 pm

mslacat wrote:
Bay Area Cat wrote:Interesting article. What publication was that pulled from? I didn't see any references in it.
Go to the link is the best advise I can give you. It appears to be an education oriented pub.

I have been Googling "Braden Miller" in their news section every so often to just check out if any new news has come out. That came up last I checked. It was a little different than alot of the fare I have seen so I posted it.
It should be printed in the Chronicle. If there is any positive in this it may be what is yet to come in terms of reform. It would be nice if the public at large could see that the administrators at MSU are determined to fix any problems they may dig up.



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Post by SonomaCat » Wed Jul 05, 2006 4:21 pm

Sorry ... I actually overlooked the link the first time. Thanks.



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Post by catmom » Wed Jul 05, 2006 11:27 pm

bobcatgrad2005 wrote:Regarding the "How many of these athletes graduate" question:

By the fall semester of 2006, all but 2 of the guys who played or suited up for their senior year of eligiablity for Bobcat football since 2000 will have graduated.

The remaining 2" Travis Lulay and Adam Cordiero.

I consider that a sucessfull statistic.
I actually asked Adam the last time he was over what he had to do to finish. He said that he had enough credits to graduate but I can't remember what it was in. He was going to be a tech ed teacher. He is now going to be an electrician.



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Post by badasscat » Thu Jul 06, 2006 8:35 am

LTown Cat wrote:
mslacat wrote:
Bay Area Cat wrote:Interesting article. What publication was that pulled from? I didn't see any references in it.
Go to the link is the best advise I can give you. It appears to be an education oriented pub.

I have been Googling "Braden Miller" in their news section every so often to just check out if any new news has come out. That came up last I checked. It was a little different than alot of the fare I have seen so I posted it.
It should be printed in the Chronicle. If there is any positive in this it may be what is yet to come in terms of reform. It would be nice if the public at large could see that the administrators at MSU are determined to fix any problems they may dig up.
Why would the Comical print that, it has a fairly positive tone to it. Seems to me that the people at that paper only print things lately that make the university look like a breeding ground for criminals. To be fair though, I know that sometimes the Chronicle does print positive/success stories about MSU athletes. However especially as of late they seem to overwhelmingly focus on the negative, and in that focus they print rumor and unfounded allegations. I haven't read the Chronicle since the first article was written about this case because they misconstrue things so much, but was wondering if and when they will print a retraction concerning the Jacques Wilson connection or lack thereof.

As a side note the article above is by far the most well written article I have read about this situation. It only contain facts and direct quotes, whoever wrote it must have taken an ethics class.


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Post by crazycat » Fri Jul 07, 2006 9:11 am

Rumor has it that there is no list of names of people who owed Wright money and it's just a tactic the police are using to get info out of people. It seems plausible, but I know nothing about police work outside of watching "Cops."



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Post by LTown Cat » Fri Jul 07, 2006 9:33 am

crazycat wrote:Rumor has it that there is no list of names of people who owed Wright money and it's just a tactic the police are using to get info out of people. It seems plausible, but I know nothing about police work outside of watching "Cops."
I think it is more logical that there was some sort of "list" and that the police and investigators are taking their time in the investigation. I am told that there hasn't been much in the Chronicle lately other than a small blurp that more arrests are "imminent". I guess it is all rumor at this point and you could be correct, but from the people I know it doesn't sound good for a few more people.



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